REFLECTOR: POLITICS: Was Re: Keep FAA Towers Running HEY

Thu Mar 14 21:56:08 CDT 2013

Don,

I agree. The problem is that is easy to get out of control on the web when
someone is willing to say things that they wouldn't call their 'friends' to
their face.

I hope we can skip all that and just decide to not talk about the politics
and focus on why we are using this forum - build Velocities. It is not a
forum about the velocity community trying to fly to airports that might not
have control towers - as an example. 

I believe we should focus on what we are trying to accomplish here, which we
have been doing for a long time and do a great job.. give each other help
and advise building airplanes. There are other outlets we can visit online
to let out our frustration about non Velocity items.

My $0.02 

Patrick

Patrick & Dana Sieders

7244 Sugarloaf Drive

Nashville TN 37211

Tel. 615-250-2304

Cell P. 615-918-2698

Cell D. 615-918-2699

Email. Js3201 at comcast.net

Http://www.sieders.com/sieders

From: reflector-bounces at tvbf.org [mailto:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org] On
Behalf Of Don Johnston
Sent: Thursday, March 14, 2013 8:49 PM
To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list
Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: POLITICS: Was Re: Keep FAA Towers Running HEY

I don't think there's any problem with political issues such as these being
discussed. 

The problem occurs when it devolves into name calling (not each other but
the different affiliations). When that happens, the whole
point of the discussion is lost and then it's just a huge waste of time.

On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 8:18 PM, Mark Magee <edjonesbrady at gmail.com> wrote:

Hi Jack,

IMHO, should we wake up 30 years from now and be in European-esque USA, with
private aviation a shell of what it once was, we'll have to chalk it up to
-not talking- about the issues, as pilots, and home builders, and aircraft
owners long in the past before the problems became overwhelming. I agree we
call our Senators and Representatives, but-we here on this board are quite
invested in the future of GA and private aviation, and, IMHO should be
allowed to name names should we wish. Kurt's Obummer and subsequent pathetic
snipes of NO POLITICS are pitiful. I understand this is not a political chat
board, but Jack, people who have one philosophy for the most part do not
-commingle- their philosophies anywhere on the web. The divide is so deep no
real discussion on topics is happening. But we can't do that here? About our
futures with our common investments in Velos and GA in general. That mindset
is foolish. Truly, if Kurt's Obummer comment throws someone over the line to
shout out NO POLITICS, it speaks of their character. Just me. As I said, I
will rattle cages when I feel it's appropriate, You -will- understand who I
voted for, and I will put POLITICS in the subject line to keep the squeamish
from suffering a possible stroke due to their inability to possibly  having
their political-belief system challenged. Delete the post. There is no rule
I'm aware of on this board, preventing someone from being offended. I was
offended by the NO POLITICS shout out. Yet I have recovered. We -all-
recover from being offended unless hopelessly immature.

My $.02. 

On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 6:41 PM, Jack Prock <jackprock at wavecable.com> wrote:

Mark,

I think you are failing to recognize that we are not against political
aviation related issues, 

rather against people blaming it on one political party or member of that
party. If I can read your

email... such as below, without easily determining how you vote, no one on
here will mind. But,

once it becomes Obama blasting, or Republican bashing, it only tends to
degenerate into political

name calling which no one wants to hear. 

The "NO POLITICS" came after the "Comrade Obummer" comment. 

My humble opinion is that we are all interested in political aviation issues
and a call to contact 

your representative is very valid, as long as the political noise and
rhetoric can be left out.

Jack

From: Mark Magee <mailto:edjonesbrady at gmail.com>  

Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2013 8:51 PM

To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list <mailto:reflector at tvbf.org>  

Cc: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list <mailto:reflector at tvbf.org>  

Subject: REFLECTOR: POLITICS: Was Re: Keep FAA Towers Running HEY

Frankly I've had it with you folks who scream about no politics on this
mailing list. It'll be great to invest a tidy sum and years of our lives in
our Velo's to lose the ability to afford to fly them, as has happened so
much in Europe and elsewhere because we listened to some weenies telling us
we can't talk about it here. You guys that that demand we don't talk about
such pertinent matters, here amongst friends with so much in common and
similarly so much to lose... I really don't have much tolerance in you
telling me I can't make my opinions known concerning the future eonomics and
functionality of owning these birds. This is Your Life, not theoreticals as
Kurt knows currently.

I encourage us to to all engage in the issues affecting the future of the
private pilot and the economics of private ownership of GA birds, HERE ON
THIS FORUM. We can, as I did here, certainly include the words POLITICS in
the subject that those who shy away from such important issues could retreat
by deleting them.

This is our lives folks. We have much to lose. I have much to lose
personally. 

Don't tell me to not talk about it -here- if you're not willing to buy me
out for my investment.

Mark B. Magee

N34XL

Sent from IPhone 4S

On Mar 13, 2013, at 10:10 PM, Jeff Barnes <jcbarnes411 at sbcglobal.net> wrote:

HEY Folks, 

   I posted this. It has nothing to do with politics, going forward anyway. 

   It has everything to do with us keeping OUR FLYING services like Towers
and ATC, and yes, help keeping Kurt's job for Kurt and thousands of
dedicated and worthy staff across the country.

   If the cuts proceed, there's nothing to say you'll every get those
services back.

  There IS movement in Congress, but this initiative NEEDS YOU TO SPEAK UP.
Follow the link to read about the Senator Moran bill, then the HARD part:
YOU have to figure out who your Senators and Reps are .. contact them in
support of Moran. Sorry, I have no links for you.

  Please jump in on this - it is OUR National Airways system. Please spare
us the bullshit about how you don't need it.

   And while you're up and about doing your civic duty, check out AOPA
article on User Fees, and IF you have a new Senator or Congressman/woman,
please encourage them to join the GA Caucus. Let your voice be heard in DC. 

Thanks,

Jeff Barnes

--- On Wed, 3/13/13, Tony Babb <tonybabb at alejandra.net> wrote:

From: Tony Babb <tonybabb at alejandra.net>
Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Keep FAA Towers Running
To: "'Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list'" <reflector at tvbf.org>
Date: Wednesday, March 13, 2013, 12:28 PM

No, just cut out the politics PLEASE. There's lots of blame to go around and
lots of other forums to express your political views.

From: reflector-bounces at tvbf.org [mailto:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org] On
Behalf Of Kurt Winker
Sent: Tuesday, March 12, 2013 10:11 PM
To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list
Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Keep FAA Towers Running

True, just honesty. Want a copy of the letter? 

KW

Sent from my iPad

On Mar 12, 2013, at 22:58, Nate Jackson
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=nate_jackson_pdx at msn.com> wrote:

NO POLITICS!!!!!!!!'

Sent from my iPhone

On Mar 12, 2013, at 9:49 PM, "Kurt Winker"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=nmflyer1 at aol.com> wrote:

Lots of furlough & closure letters around, I got mine. According to the
wording in the letter, Only National Interest concerns will be considered,
the rest, shit canned. Thanks comrade Obummer. 

Kurt

Albuquerque Center

Sent from my iPad

On Mar 12, 2013, at 22:29, Jeff Barnes
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=jcbarnes411 at sbcglobal.net> wrote:

FYI: Somebody please post to Van's forums - I don't have the address.

Thanks,

Jeff Barnes

--- On Tue, 3/12/13, Tim Stearns
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=waiex052 at gmail.com> wrote:

From: Tim Stearns <wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=waiex052 at gmail.com>

Subject: Fw: FW: Tuesday AM Follow Up

To: "Tye Hammerlye" <wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=tye at leakpath.com>, "Avery
Bloom" <wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=Avery.Boom at gmail.com>, "Jim and Nolan
Langer" <wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=rayrayl81 at yahoo.com>, "Andrew Roerkohl"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=73blacksheep at gmail.com>, "Terry Yarbrough"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=td1yarb at hotmail.com>, "Kevin Smyk"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=smykkv at gmail.com>, "Jim Renagon"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=jrenagon at wi.rr.com>, "Ron Pearson"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=ronaldepearson at hotmail.com>, "Lenny Kotowski"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=vinoman25 at gmail.com>, "James and Hunter Huggins"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=hugginsj at tds.net>, "Marie Spear"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=mcspear41 at gmail.com>, "Pete Spear"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=stearman42S at gmail.com>, "Jerome Cole"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=romeykc135 at hotmail.com>, "Nerieda Cole"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=nerdc01 at att.net>, "Dave Harris"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=mothflyer at gmail.com>, "David Baughman"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=dbaughman at wi.rr.com>, "Kirby EAA 217 Timm"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=ktimm at tnainc.com>, "MIKE EAA 217 LEONAITIS"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=LEONAITI at sbcglobal.NET>, "Mitch EAA 414 Brown"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=hatzman at q.com>, "Ken Ramsay"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=rak550 at msn.com>,
wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=afremich at hotmail.com, "Mark EAA 217 Matula"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=mmatula at ratula.net>, "Jerry Myers"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=jmyers at Natgun.com>, "Bob Herrick"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=ipilot at sbcglobal.net>, "Steve Schuerr"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=sdschuerr at live.com>, "JOE EAA 217 CZAPLICKI"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=fishin3 at sbcglobal.net>, "John EAA 217 Munson"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=john-munson at sbcglobal.net>, "JIM EAA 217
SPRINGER" <wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=Jim at sixspringers.com>, "ROB & DAWN EAA
217 LUCE" <wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=ROBLUCE1 at yahoo.com>, "Greg Markus"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=gamarkus at inbox.com>, "Don EAA 217 Lien"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=donlien at hotmail.com>, "Tony EAA 414 Niec"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=amniec at consolidatedchemical.com>, "Tom EAA 217
Howard" <wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=HDSPRINT43 at cs.com>, "Warren EAA 217
Levin" <wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=wdblevin at gmail.com>, "Greg CAP"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=patchel at msn.com>, "Chris EAA 217 Laskey"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=chris at midwesternhelicopter.com>, "Tim EAA 217
Stearns" <wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=waiex052 at gmail.com>, "EAA CHAPTER
OFFICE" <wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=CHAPTERS at EAA.ORG>, "Richard EAA 217
Priebus" <wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=rpriebus at yahoo.com>,
wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=dsprake at pamiusa.com, "Kevin Conley"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=Kevin.Conley at united.com>, "Steve Matthews"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=smmatthe at gmail.com>, "Brian EAA 217 Whittier"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=Bwwhittier at aol.com>, "John EAA 217 Andersen"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=f1rocket at wi.rr.com>, "JOE EAA 217 SEXTON"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=sextonjc at hotmail.COM>, "Jeff EAA 217 Cady"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=jeffreycady at hotmail.com>, "Jeff EAA 414 Barnes"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=jcbarnes411 at sbcglobal.net>, "Greg Haase"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=greghaase at rocketmail.com>, "David McCormick"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=davidsrv6 at ameritech.net>, "Hyde Perce"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=hydeperce at comcast.net>, "JIM EAA 414 HULL"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=hullhouse at tds.net>, "Dan EAA 217 Hollowell"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=cueball411 at yahoo.com>,
wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=Sieversg3 at aol.com, "Ken EAA 217 Sack"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=kensack at yahoo.com>, "Karl EAA 217 Rabenhorst"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=karl-rabenhorst at navy.mil>, "Mike EAA 217 Modde"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=mfmodde at yahoo.com>, "Matt Baughman"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=mbaughman123 at gmail.com>, "Matt EAA 217 Schmitt"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=Matt.Schmitt at insinkerator.com>, "Leah Garcia"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=leahgarcia at gmail.com>, "EAA 217 Marty Whyte"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=whytedesigns at hotmail.com>, "TOM EAA 217 LUBBEN"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=lub_sur at sbcglobal.net>
Cc: "Don Mildebrandt"
<wlmailhtml:/mc/compose?to=don.mildebrandt at midwestatcs.com>

Date: Tuesday, March 12, 2013, 10:12 PM

Chapter Members,

Now hear this, now hear this!

Write your US Senator in support of the Moran amendment to the Continuing
Resolution on the Federal budget withdrawing 50 million in un-obligated FAA
research and capital funds from prior appropriation bills.  These funds will
help keep contract Towers including Kenosha Tower in business for the
current fiscal year in the wake of Sequestration.   See this link for more
background on the proposed amendment to the Federal Budget CR.  Reach out to
me with any questions.

http://www.hayspost.com/2013/03/12/moran-stop-cuts-to-air-traffic-towers/

Forward this request to any and all aviation minded people who will help
with our just cause in the interest of public safety.  There is plenty of
fraud waste and abuse elsewhere in the Federal budget that can more than
fund the FAA contract Towers which operate on a comparable annual budget of
1.5 million dollars less than an equal FAA staffed tower.  

Regards,

Tim Stearns, President EAA Chapter 217
10124 70th St.
Kenosha, WI 53142
Phone: 262-945-7244
e-mail: waiex052 at gmail.com

----- Original Message ----- 

From: donald mildebrandt 

To: Tim Stearns 

Sent: Tuesday, March 12, 2013 8:02 AM

Subject: Fwd: FW: Tuesday AM Follow Up

Tim,   

This is the latest as of this morning.  The best thing we can do right now
is to have people call our senators and request that they sign onto the
Moran amendment.  It is being proposed today.  Anyone that you can think of
to pass this along to would be greatly appreciated.

Don Mildebrandt
ENW ATM
(262) 652-2110 <tel:%28262%29%20652-2110>  ex2

From: Spencer Dickerson [mailto:Spencer.Dickerson at aaae.org] 
Sent: Tuesday, March 12, 2013 8:32 AM
Cc: Joel Bacon; Gwen Papineau Basaria
Subject: Tuesday AM Follow Up 

As a follow up to the ALA alert yesterday (included below), it is absolutely
CRITICAL that airports that care about keeping their contract towers open
call or email your two U.S. Senators IMMEDIATELY and ask them to support
Senator Jerry Moran's amendment to the continuing resolution (see details
below) to save contract towers. ALSO, we encourage you to urge your aviation
tenants, local pilot community, and local business/political leaders to do
the same. The more phone calls and emails from your community to both of
your Senators the better!

As a reminder, you can click on the links below to get the phone numbers of
your congressional delegation.

.         House <http://www.house.gov/representatives/find/> 

.         Senate
<http://www.senate.gov/general/contact_information/senators_cfm.cfm> 

We have seen lots of good email traffic since we sent this alert yesterday,
but quite frankly we need a lot more noise to make sure we have the support
of both Republicans and Democrats for the Moran amendment.

KEEP FIGHTING! We have an uphill battle so we need EVERYONE fully engaged
right away.

Spencer Dickerson

AAAE

601 Madison Street

Alexandria, VA  22314

phone 703/824-0500 <tel:703%2F824-0500> , ext. 130

sdickerson at aaae.org

From: Gwen Basaria [mailto:gwen.papineau at aaae.org] 
Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 12:51 PM
To: Gwen Papineau Basaria
Subject: ACTION ALERT: Call Your Senators NOW to Support Moran Amendment to
Keep Contract Towers Open

ACTION ALERT:  Call Your Senators NOW to Support Moran Amendment to Keep
Contract Towers Open

March 11, 2013

The ALA staff has been in contact with Kansas Senator Jerry Moran (R-KS)
over the weekend and has met with his staff this morning regarding the
imminent closure of 173 contract towers on April 7 with 16 additional
contract towers to close by the end of the fiscal year.  Senator Moran is
very concerned about the impact of these closures on Kansas airports and the
national aviation system and has indicated that he intends to offer an
amendment to the "continuing resolution" that the Senate will consider this
week aimed at keeping these towers open.  

We cannot emphasize enough how important it is for you to contact your
Senators now to urge them to contact Senator Moran's office to sign on as a
co-sponsor of the Moran amendment to keep towers open.   This is an
important bipartisan issue with implications for all areas of the country,
so please act now to call your Senators from both parties.  It is critical
that these calls be placed today.  It is also critical that you communicate
back to us on what you are hearing back from your Senator's offices so that
we can effectively target our resources.     

The continuing resolution that the Senate will consider this week is the
only piece of must-pass legislation that lawmakers will consider between now
and the April 7 target date for tower closures.  So, this is our last, best
chance to get Congress to act to stop the planned closures.  To be clear,
this remains a very, uphill battle, so we need everyone who cares about
keeping these towers open to weigh in now.  

Suggested Talking Points:

*	I am calling to urge Senator [Last Name] to act now to keep the
contract tower at my airport open beyond April 7 - the date on which the FAA
has targeted this critical facility for closure.  
*	Keeping this vital facility open is critical to the future of our
airport and our community. 

*	It is my understanding that Senator Jerry Moran and others plan to
offer an amendment to the continuing resolution that the Senate will
consider this week aimed at keeping contract towers open. 

*	Please  call Senator Moran's office today to co-sponsor this
important amendment to keep our tower open. 

*	I appreciate your consideration and will be closely following how
Senator [Last Name] votes on this critical issue.   

We will have keep you apprised of developments, so stay tuned for further
information and calls to action.  For more information, contact Joel Bacon
at 703-575-2478. 

Todd Hauptli, President, AAAE Gov

Joel Bacon, Vice President

Brad Van Dam, Vice President

Gwen Papineau Basaria, Director

This email was sent to gwen.basaria at aaae.org by gwen.papineau at aaae.org |   

Update Profile/Email Address
<http://visitor.constantcontact.com/do?p=oo&mse=001RmASHJDEZJZ4GwgevThzSszF6
hR9Bf14Wb0jVHNo71s%3D&t=001fy9ncjjulaPe-udpxjvk3w%3D%3D&llr=anv8b8cab>  |
Instant removal with SafeUnsubscribe
<http://visitor.constantcontact.com/do?p=un&mse=001RmASHJDEZJZ4GwgevThzSszF6
hR9Bf14Wb0jVHNo71s%3D&t=001fy9ncjjulaPe-udpxjvk3w%3D%3D&llr=anv8b8cab> T |
Privacy Policy <http://ui.constantcontact.com/roving/CCPrivacyPolicy.jsp> .

AAAE | 601 Madison Street, Suite 400 | Alexandria | VA | 22314

-- 

-- 

_______________________________________________
To change your email address, visit
http://www.tvbf.org/mailman/listinfo/reflector