REFLECTOR: VG
Karl J. Warner
karljwarnerpa at earthlink.net
Fri Jan 6 11:51:12 CST 2012
When I bought my plane from the factory (80 hrs) it had VG's. Very quickly I found them to be brittle and a nuisance. I took them all off and flew for about a year and found the airplane to be a much bigger handful slow with a very pronounced canard stall.
I decided to put these on: http://www.hallwindmeter.com/vortex.php bought 15 of them for $50 including shipping after a little negotiating. Painted up and easy to clean around I LOVE them (630+ hrs now). I have excellant prop clearance so if needed I get real slow flying her onto the runway at 60knts lightly loaded. I can also land main wheels first and "fly the nose down" long after the mains are on... something I hear others find difficult to do regularly.
My airplane is a short wing SE FWIW,
Karl
On Jan 6, 2012, at 12:26 PM, reflector-request at tvbf.org wrote:
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> 1. Re: VG (Brian Michalk)
>
> From: Brian Michalk <michalk at awpi.com>
> Date: January 6, 2012 12:28:37 PM EST
> To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list <reflector at tvbf.org>
> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: VG
> Reply-To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list <reflector at tvbf.org>
>
>
> I fail to see how trailing edge fences work!
> They are behind all of the surfaces that would make a difference. I'm not denying that they work, I just don't understand how they could work.
>
> On 1/6/2012 11:00 AM, Stockman, Bill wrote:
>>
>> One benefit I noticed with the fences is it helped stabilize the plane on final approach at lower speeds—it keeps the ailerons effective longer. You can seem them in the new calendar (I’m Miss September!).
>>
>> Bill Stockman
>> Senior Associate
>> Dayton Aerospace, Inc.
>>
>> 937.426.4300 Office
>> 937.369.4799 Cell
>> bill.stockman at daytonaero.com
>> www.daytonaero.com
>>
>> From: reflector-bounces at tvbf.org [mailto:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org] On Behalf Of nmflyer1 at aol.com
>> Sent: Friday, January 06, 2012 11:32 AM
>> To: reflector at tvbf.org
>> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: VG
>>
>> Bill,
>>
>> That is just the kind of information I needed. I kept self debating whether to install the VGs or to fly it first and see if I thought I needed them. I am really not too keen on installing those things due to the pains in keeping them on , things clean & not bleeding! If they actually provide a significant benefit, then I believe it would be worth it .
>>
>> Since my 173 FGE is quite a bit different than most, one never knows just how much benefit can be attained by VGs, but your input is appreciated.
>>
>> I have mentioned the high density altitude that I fly at (5000' field elevation and high summer temps), and the relatively short runway for canards at high DA (4450').
>>
>> Things done to address this condition:
>>
>> - Long wing (173) instead of short
>>
>> - Elevator cuffs not installed
>>
>> - 340 HP aluminum engine
>>
>> - 76" 3-blade constant speed prop
>>
>> - modified lower winglets installed (about half size)
>>
>> - speed brake
>>
>> - extra rudder throw
>>
>> I hope with all of these things (and most likely the VGs) that I will have a velocity that is safe and capable at our high density altitudes.
>>
>> Thanks again
>>
>> Kurt
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Stockman, Bill <bill.stockman at daytonaero.com>
>> To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list <reflector at tvbf.org>
>> Sent: Fri, Jan 6, 2012 4:17 am
>> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: VG
>>
>> I’ve flown with and without them on my 173FGE and they make a difference, I also added trailing edge fences and they make a difference. With both, I can put the plane into 2000 ft runways or clear trees. I flew for ten years out of Moraine airpark in Dayton which is short, 20 ft river levees at both ends and 75 ft mature trees—the velocity handled all with great ease. The trick was learning to slow down on the approach and landing. Anyone can fly fast, but learning to slow down on final is a must and the VGs and fences help a lot—especially for those of us who don’t have those big MT rotating speed brakes.
>>
>> Bill Stockman
>> Senior Associate
>> Dayton Aerospace, Inc.
>>
>> 937.426.4300 Office
>> 937.369.4799 Cell
>> bill.stockman at daytonaero.com
>> www.daytonaero.com
>>
>> From: reflector-bounces at tvbf.org [mailto:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org] On Behalf Of Peter Braswell
>> Sent: Friday, January 06, 2012 10:59 AM
>> To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list
>> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: VG
>>
>> All,
>> The VG's seem to be a bit of a pain to deal with. I was wondering about the tangible benefit they provide and are they worth the heart burn?
>>
>> I had VG's on my Glastar. They were however just triangular shaped devices that were mounted just above the airfoil out on the leading edge and they roughly followed the curvature of the wing. There were two on each wing, one mounted about 3/4 outboard and the other right at the root. They were advertised to lower the stall speed and to help maintain aileron effectiveness at low airspeeds. I ended up removing the root mounted VG's to better seal the wing root area (the cabin was drafty) and I didn't notice one bit of difference in either handling or the stall speed.
>>
>> Peter
>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> "It's a Jungle Up There": www.zuluworks.com
>> Great Aviation Gear: www.sky-gadgets.com
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Jan 6, 2012 at 9:52 AM, Scott Derrick <scott at tnstaafl.net> wrote:
>> I have CC I vg's on my plane. They are OK. They are sharp and care must be used when washing the plane. They also get brittle over time, they are not UV proof as advertised.
>>
>>
>> Barry Gibbons <gibbons at as.net> wrote:
>> I was looking at Velocity‘s store web site and they didn’t have the VG for the wings and canard. I found a place called CCI of New Jersey has any body used their VGs?
>> Barry
>>
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