No subject
Tue Sep 12 21:10:27 CDT 2006
Solenoid valve P/N 05-29823
elbows AN822-2D
tee AN826-2D
nipple AN816-2D
nuts AN818-2D
sleeve AN819-2D
1/8" aluminum tubing
----- Original Message -----
From: Hiroo Umeno<mailto:humeno at microsoft.com>
To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list<mailto:reflector at tvbf.org>
Sent: Monday, September 04, 2006 11:21 PM
Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Franklin
Steven did warn me about the induction fire danger with pumping the throttl=
e. He told me that I can pump exactly once.
It seems to me that a primer is a virtual necessity with one of these engin=
es. Does anyone have a part list for the setup? I'd like to order the par=
ts and get started on it next time when I head out to the hangar. I imagin=
e it is a fairly simple setup.
Hiroo
________________________________
From: reflector-bounces at tvbf.org [mailto:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org] On Beh=
alf Of MikeWatsonSpg at cs.com
Sent: Monday, September 04, 2006 12:21 PM
To: reflector at tvbf.org
Subject: REFLECTOR: Franklin
Hiroo,
What ever you do, please do not pump the throttle to
start the engine. Both Denis and I had fires while trying
to start our engines at F. 40
I was lucky, no damage. Denis Miller cowls and firewall were
burnt very badly. After that incident, we installed the
fuel injector rails with a solenoid. Now our procedure
for starting is the same as Larry stated. Follow Larry's
suggestions and you will be OK.
The Franklin is a great engine, it takes a lot of abuse,
Idles like a dragster and runs as smooth as silk between
2500 and 2700 RPM. Mine has given me excellent service
for nine years now.
Mike W.
SERG Franklin/IVO Electric CS
________________________________
_______________________________________________
To change your email address, visit http://www.tvbf.org/mailman/listinfo/re=
flector
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<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D862131701-16092006><FONT face=3DA=
rial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>Last weekend, I went to the hangar with my wife.&n=
bsp; We=20
pulled the cowl off, pulled the plug and went to work on them. While =
there=20
was no sign of deposit evident on them, some of them (particularly bottoms =
of=20
No. 5 and No. 6) were soaked with oil. We soaked all of them in lacqu=
er=20
thinned, then took stainless-steel brushes to clean off any deposit that mi=
ght=20
have formed. After drying them all out, we put graphite lube on the=20
threads and installed them to 360inch/lb torque. While the =
cowl=20
still off, I tried starting it again.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D862131701-16092006></SPAN> <=
/DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D862131701-16092006><FONT face=3DA=
rial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>This time, it will not start AT ALL. I tried=
about 6=20
times, each time cranking for about 10 - 15 seconds each. Heeding=20
you'all's advise, I did not pump the throttle while not cranking and I=
=20
tried one and two strokes of throttle movement on two occasions. I tr=
ied=20
booster ON and OFF, Mixture rich and leaned. After each attempt, I le=
t the=20
engine sit for a minute or so so as not to build up unburnt fuel in the=20
system.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D862131701-16092006><FONT face=3DA=
rial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D862131701-16092006><FONT face=3DA=
rial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>I suspected flooding or otherwise over-fueling, so=
after=20
some of the attempts, I got out and sniffed around the exhaust for AVGAS=20
smell. To my surprize, I did not smell much at all. Admittedly,=
it=20
was a bit of a windy day but I was standing downwind and I would have smell=
ed=20
fuel.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D862131701-16092006></SPAN> <=
/DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D862131701-16092006><FONT face=3DA=
rial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>I should note that I got it to make the "Brr"=
noise=20
once indicating there was some ignition but it did not=20
catch.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D862131701-16092006><FONT face=3DA=
rial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D862131701-16092006><FONT face=3DA=
rial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>My fuel system is a fairly standard FG setup with =
sump and=20
electrical boost pump. I have the Franklin fuel pump AD done with a b=
ypass=20
with a check valve. I do not have the primer yet (parts are on=20
order).</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D862131701-16092006><FONT face=3DA=
rial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D862131701-16092006><FONT face=3DA=
rial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>The sump pickup is on the bottom as factory specif=
ies and=20
the fuel line run "uphill" for a bit to about halfway between the carry-thr=
ough=20
spar and fuselage bottom where the boost pump, flow sensor and fuel filter =
is=20
located. From there, the line goes through the firewall, to a T-fitti=
ng=20
that separates the bypass line and the feed to the mechanical pump. A=
fter=20
the pumpl, it will re-merge and drop down to the Carb. The fuel=20
pressure sensor is located at the Carb.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D862131701-16092006></SPAN> <=
/DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D862131701-16092006><FONT face=3DA=
rial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>When I turn on the boost pump prior to cranking, t=
he fuel=20
flow and pressure both indicate activity indicating that fuel is=20
flowing.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D862131701-16092006><FONT face=3DA=
rial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D862131701-16092006><FONT face=3DA=
rial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>I am really scratching my head as to what may be=20
causing this difficulty and how I could debug the problem. With =
the=20
electrical system, I can go around poing each connections with a multimeter=
and=20
what not but I am at a loss as to what to do with the power=20
plant.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D862131701-16092006></SPAN> <=
/DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D862131701-16092006><FONT face=3DA=
rial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>Somehow, I am suspecting that the fuel is not gett=
ing to=20
the carb, based on the absense of fuel smell in the exhaust stack after=20
unsuccessful tries. Is that a fair assumption?</FONT> </SPAN></D=
IV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff size=3D2><SPAN class=3D862131701-16=
092006>One=20
thought that did occur this week was to run the electric boost pump until I=
see=20
fuel pressure and continue running until I see the flow drop to near 0=20
indicating that the bowl on the Carb is full and the float has tipped the f=
uel=20
supply off. Perhaps the fuel line is filled with air while the aircra=
ft=20
sits on the ground.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D862131701-16092006></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff size=3D2><SPAN class=3D862131701-16=
092006>Is=20
this a sound reasoning?</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D862131701-16092006></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff size=3D2><SPAN=20
class=3D862131701-16092006>Hiroo</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV class=3DOutlookMessageHeader lang=3Den-us dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft>
<HR tabIndex=3D-1>
<FONT face=3DTahoma size=3D2><B>From:</B> reflector-bounces at tvbf.org=20
[mailto:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org] <B>On Behalf Of </B>Laurence=20
Coen<BR><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, September 05, 2006 8:47 AM<BR><B>To:</B> Velo=
city=20
Aircraft Owners and Builders list<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: REFLECTOR:=20
Franklin<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>Hiroo,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>Here's how I did it. I made my primer injectors f=
orm two=20
AN822-2D elbows that are screwed into the bottom center primer port on each=
=20
manifold. The original Franklin primer manifold injects fuel at three=
=20
points in each manifold. The threads on the manifold plug are straight and =
not=20
pipe. You can convert them to pipe by running a pipe tap in a few tur=
ns=20
because the thread pitch and diameter are a match. I made a spray noz=
zle=20
by tapping the inside of the AN822-2D for a short brass screw and drilling =
it=20
lengthwise with a #60 drill. I used #2 Permatex on the threads so it=
=20
couldn't vibrate loose. You need to tee into your fuel system on the=
=20
pressure side of your electric fuel pump. This goes to a solenoid val=
ve=20
which is in turn plumbed to the injectors. You will need wire and a p=
ush=20
button switch to operate the solenoid valve.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>From Aircraft Spruce</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>Solenoid valve P/N 05-29823</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>elbows AN822-2D</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>tee AN826-2D</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>nipple AN816-2D</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>nuts AN818-2D</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>sleeve AN819-2D</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>1/8" aluminum tubing</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LE=
FT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV=20
style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>Fro=
m:</B>=20
<A title=3Dhumeno at microsoft.com href=3D"mailto:humeno at microsoft.com">Hiro=
o=20
Umeno</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=3Dreflector at tvbf.org=
=20
href=3D"mailto:reflector at tvbf.org">Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders=
=20
list</A> </DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Monday, September 04, 2006 1=
1:21=20
PM</DIV>
<DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: REFLECTOR: Franklin</=
DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D318291904-05092006><FONT face=
=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>Steven did warn me about the induction fire dang=
er with=20
pumping the throttle. He told me that I can pump exactly=20
once.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D318291904-05092006><FONT face=
=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D318291904-05092006><FONT face=
=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>It seems to me that a primer is a virtual necess=
ity with=20
one of these engines. Does anyone have a part list for the setup?&n=
bsp;=20
I'd like to order the parts and get started on it next time when I head o=
ut to=20
the hangar. I imagine it is a fairly simple setup.</FONT></SPAN></D=
IV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D318291904-05092006><FONT face=
=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><SPAN class=3D318291904-05092006><FONT face=
=3DArial=20
color=3D#0000ff size=3D2>Hiroo</FONT></SPAN></DIV><BR>
<DIV class=3DOutlookMessageHeader lang=3Den-us dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft>
<HR tabIndex=3D-1>
<FONT face=3DTahoma size=3D2><B>From:</B> reflector-bounces at tvbf.org=20
[mailto:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org] <B>On Behalf Of=20
</B>MikeWatsonSpg at cs.com<BR><B>Sent:</B> Monday, September 04, 2006 12:21=
=20
PM<BR><B>To:</B> reflector at tvbf.org<BR><B>Subject:</B> REFLECTOR:=20
Franklin<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>
<DIV></DIV><FONT face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT lang=3D0 face=3DArial size=
=3D2=20
FAMILY=3D"SANSSERIF" PTSIZE=3D"10">Hiroo,<BR><BR>What ever you do, please=
do not=20
pump the throttle to <BR>start the engine. Both Denis and I had fires whi=
le=20
trying<BR>to start our engines at F. 40 <BR><BR>I was lucky, no damage. D=
enis=20
Miller cowls and firewall were<BR>burnt very badly. After that incident, =
we=20
installed the <BR>fuel injector rails with a solenoid. Now our procedure=
=20
<BR>for starting is the same as Larry stated. Follow Larry's<BR>suggestio=
ns=20
and you will be OK.<BR><BR>The Franklin is a great engine, it takes a lot=
of=20
abuse,<BR>Idles like a dragster and runs as smooth as silk between<BR>250=
0 and=20
2700 RPM. Mine has given me excellent service<BR>for nine years now.=20
<BR><BR>Mike W.<BR>SERG Franklin/IVO Electric CS<BR></FONT></FONT>
<P>
<HR>
<P></P>_______________________________________________<BR>To change your =
email=20
address, visit http://www.tvbf.org/mailman/listinfo/reflector<BR><BR>Visi=
t the=20
gallery! www.tvbf.org/gallery<BR>user:pw =3D tvbf:jamaicangoose<BR>=
Check=20
new archives: www.tvbf.org/pipermail<BR>Check old archives:=20
http://www.tvbf.org/archives/velocity/maillist.html</BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></=
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