REFLECTOR: Fusing distribution lines

Tue Aug 1 08:06:47 CDT 2006

Al,
Thanks for this.  I am going to use your suggestion on the schottky's.
I'll have them protecting the batteries as well as any reverse feed back
off the ess to the main.  I see there are many ways to skin the cat!!
Terry

-----Original Message-----
From: reflector-bounces at tvbf.org [mailto:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org] On
Behalf Of Al Gietzen
Sent: Tuesday, August 01, 2006 1:13 AM
To: 'Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list'
Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Fusing distribution lines

Did either of you fuse your battery-fed-to-essential distribution
line--that is the wire running from your battery hot bus to the
emergency feed into your essential bus. 

No, Terry. I fused the circuits downstream.  Similarly the lead to the
contactors; and contactor to essentials bus is not protected. Protection
is the circuit breakers on the downstream side.  That should be shown on
the circuit diagram I sent you.

The batteries to critical bus are isolated by the Schottky diodes to
protect from one side going down.  I don't like the relay on that
critical path just to eliminate the possibility of relay failure;
however remote.

Al

 I am doing this with a 700 series toggle switch that will control a 30
amp relay.  I am just trying to decide whether to put a say 40 amp fuse
on the #10awg running from the Hot Batt bus to the relay #30 lug and out
the 87 to the essential bus?  What did you guys do?  Obviously I am
fusing my alternator feed line with a fuseable link, but should I also
fuse my Batt Only bus feed lines in the event of a major component draw
or short to ground or whatever on the client bus?  

Thanks

Terry

-----Original Message-----
From: reflector-bounces at tvbf.org [mailto:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org] On
Behalf Of Keith Hallsten
Sent: Monday, July 17, 2006 9:38 PM
To: 'Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list'
Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Bus, Battery & Back Order

Terry,

Everyone will have their specific requirements, based on their
background and the way they intend to use their plane.  Thus, what
others have done is a source of ideas, but ultimately not very relevant
to your own decisions.

I have ordered my plug-n-play panel from Stein Bruch.  We are currently
exchanging drawings to get to final conclusions regarding exact
locations of equipment, switches, etc.  

I went with the dual-display, single AHRS, GRT "Horizon" EFIS.  I
seriously considered their "Sport" EFIS, but it was not actually
shipping at the time I placed my order (the last I heard it was to start
shipping today), and it isn't entirely clear that the way certain
functions are implemented will satisfy me.  There comes a point in every
project when you have to "pull the trigger" on the order and at that
point you need to choose from equipment that is actually available.

For in-panel backups, I have a mechanical airspeed and altimeter and the
TruTrak "ADI Pilot 2" autopilot which provides attitude and bearing
information, even when the autopilot is not in use.  I decided to put
the "handheld" G-396 backup GPS in a panel dock, which makes it a
"semi-panel-mount".  That way I don't have extra wires to get tangled
in, and I can actually wire it up to the EFIS as well.

For the handheld backup comm radio I'm installing a panel jack to
connect to the second comm antenna in the other winglet and a "cigarette
lighter" style of power receptacle.  This will back up the single SL-30
Nav/Comm in the panel.

I'm going to put in two batteries, mostly so that the LASAR ignition and
EIS 6000 engine monitor can run off a separate battery during starting.
I will determine the battery size after I have done the weight and
balance.  Once the engine is running I will tie the batteries together,
so it won't be a true two-bus system.  I will have an "endurance" bus,
though.  Since I will have no vacuum system, I couldn't resist putting
an SD-8 dynamo on the vacuum pump pad.

I didn't like the design of the Velocity exhaust system that was
available at the time, so I got an exhaust system made to my
specifications by Custom Aircraft Parts of El Cajon, CA.  Clint Anderson
shipped it to me less than a week after I ordered it, so backorder was
not an issue! 

Keith Hallsten, XLFG

N585V (reserved)

  _____  

From: reflector-bounces at tvbf.org [mailto:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org] On
Behalf Of Al Gietzen
Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 10:36 PM
To: 'Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list'
Subject: RE: REFLECTOR: Bus, Battery & Back Order

Keith;

It sounds like we have taken a pretty similar approach to the panel.
Except I have digital electronic backups and no gauges.

I just completed all electrical, and checkout of the things in the panel
(Well; still some wire 'dressing' to do.)  As far as I can check here on
the ground everything works (yippee!) - er, except the Trutrak AP.  

I expect I'm an isolated case, but I have not been happy with it from
the start.  Had to return the servo because it was sticking, and now the
programmer module isn't working.  They are assuring me that they will do
whatever is needed to make things right; which I appreciate, but if I
were doing it over I would opt for the Trio EZ pilot. One reason is the
Trio servo gears disengage when the unit is off - the Trutrak unit
doesn't and puts some unnecessary drag on the controls.

I also have the SL-30, and put in an I-COM panel mount for a COM 2.
Inexpensive; and from what I've heard, they work fine.  I think it is
basically a knockoff of an earlier King model.

Photo of panel attached.

Now to get busy on the interior.

Al (I'll probably run the engine tomorrow, haven't heard it for a few
weeks :-))

I have also been meditating on backup for the single-AHRS, two-display
GRT

EFIS.  Although I may change my mind again, I am also settling on
mechanical

airspeed and altimeter.  Therefore, I'll probably leave out the backup

airspeed and altimeter in the EIS - I'll talk to them at OSH next month

about the value of cross-check info to the EFIS.  The GRT EIS 6000 will
be

the only source of engine instrumentation (loss of engine instruments is
a

nuisance, not an emergency).  I plan to use either a TruTrak Pictorial
Pilot

or their upcoming ADI Pilot as the

autopilot-and-combination-backup-attitude-indicator.  After that, the

backups come out of the flight bag!

I'm going with the internal GPS in the EFIS as the only panel-mount GPS
for

the first couple of "VFR only" years.  I plan to leave a space for a GNS

430, but not install it until and unless I establish that I need the

additional capability the way I fly.  I'll have a handheld GPS with
fresh

batteries up and running on cross-country flights.

I'm putting in a single SL-30 Nav/Com, and carrying a handheld comm
radio as

backup.  I'm going to talk to the vendors at OSH about satellite weather

options - that seems like a pretty valuable capability in a
cross-country

airplane.

Keith Hallsten

(I mounted my straight heated pitot out the nose of the XLFG this week.

Looks cool!) 

-----Original Message-----

From: reflector-bounces at tvbf.org [mailto:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org] On

Behalf Of Terrence Miles

Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2005 12:27 PM

To: reflector at tvbf.org

Subject: REFLECTOR: Bus, Battery & Back Order

Hi to everyone but in particular to Brian, Keith, Al G, and Kurt who I
think

are deep into wire issues.

Here's what I got.

For Electrics:  Here's my current plan and why.  Two big batts in the
nose.

One stacked on top of the other.  For now I am going to slap the ground 

leads together and run them in parallel with B&C L60 alternator (60
amps) 

and the B&C external voltage regulator and the o'volt protection.

I may one day with not a lot of effort, put in a 2nd aux battery
contactor, 

but I see its practical value as limited due to what follows next.

I have decided in favor of a single power bus.  I can't see a strong
enuf 

reason to break things into separate buses to power up or shed in event
of 

alternator problems.  I will instead pull out a checklist and do a load
shed

procedure at each components control head/ panel switch/CB/whatever.
(Two 

mags, by the way until I have her in the air and de-bugged)

When I re-read the Nuckols stuff  on dual batt & single alt, I decided
it 

wasn't for guys like me.  I can put two equal amphr batts right side by 

side...read no #2awg wires running all over hell.  I don't have dual
EI's.  

Sure as sh--t the day I loss a alternator would be the day the #1 comm
would

be TU and I have to repower the main load buss to access #2 comm and get

myself confused say 2 years down the road by which time all the electron

theory will be faded into dim memory.

GRT stuff:  Single AHRS system, 2 screens, EIS in the radio stack, no 

airspeed&Alt add-on to the EIS in favor of round dials below the GRT 

screeens.  Decided basically to abandon the two spare power leads.  I am

told a solenoid controlled contact can draw an amp to 1.5 amps just to
hold 

closed, and the diodes will cost you a volt in pressure.

Some of the above was driven by electrical abnormal checklist drafting.

Some from the local tower operator/Cozy guy/ex USAF avionics tech.  For 

backup, his personal philos is a bag of external hand helds.

What do you four think of this?  Anybody else want to chime in?

I called Affordable panels this week.  He is an RV vendor...uses the 

Approach Hub stuff.  He is very backed up.  I am looking to make the
major 

buy with Stein Air.  Anybody have any comments on him?

Where's everybody else on this topic.  Are you guys going to wire up
your 

own intercomponents in the avionics rack?

Last but not least...anybody else waiting for engine mounts and exhaust 

systems besides me??

Regards,

Terry

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