REFLECTOR:More Insurance Woes
Chuck Jensen
reflector@tvbf.org
Tue, 6 May 2003 16:56:21 -0400
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All,
The seeming endless inconsistencies and disparities of insurance practices
are not really incongruent when you consider that "they just make up the
rules as they go along." Honest, no kidding. Insurance underwriting and
the weather have one thing in common; they change daily...and usually for
the worse. As Hytec45 mentioned, the insurance companies took a whippin' on
9/11, and now we're the "whippees."
It's so darn complicated, but a Coop for hull insurance that was talked
about in the Newsletter really does make good sense. Hull insurance is a
different animal than liability insurance because hull damage is
quantifiable and estimable, unlike liability which only stops at the limits
of a lawyer's mind.
I'm not going to volunteer to set it up, but a non-profit Coop that charged
3-5% of the hull value and rebated the excess over the paid-loss experience
(and overhead), could end up providing hull insurance for an effective 1-2%
of the hull value.....which is something we could all live with. The loss
experience on the Velocity since the Factory started their Checkout and
Aircraft inspection program has improved markedly (at least according to
anecdotal comments in the Newsletter).
If someone is brave enough (ne: stupid enough) to want to think about
setting up a Coop, I'd be willing to seriously consider putting in seed
money. I suspect that Velocity would be most helpful in establishing a
"relationship" to the factory for continued aircraft inspection and pilot
checkouts. Given the relatively low cost of repairing Velocities compared
to Kansas Cans after a fender-bender, there is little reason that hull
insurance should be 5% of the value of the plane....when we can even get it.
If I lived in FL close to the Factory, I'd try doing it tomorrow, but I
don't, so I won't, but that doesn't mean it's not a good idea for someone
else that has time on their hands, is organized, knows Velocities and is
hands-on.
Chuck
-----Original Message-----
From: reflector-admin@tvbf.org [mailto:reflector-admin@tvbf.org]On Behalf Of
Andy Millin
Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 3:36 PM
To: reflector@tvbf.org
Subject: RE: REFLECTOR:More Insurance Woes
Bob,
Funny, I JUST renewed my "Aircraft Under Construction" with Avemco. It was
$550/yr.
Andy
-----Original Message-----
From: reflector-admin@tvbf.org [mailto:reflector-admin@tvbf.org]On Behalf Of
Bob Hugel
Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 3:31 PM
To: reflector@tvbf.org
Subject: RE: REFLECTOR:More Insurance Woes
Larry,
I called Avemco on Thursday of last week to ask about Builders Insurance.
They told me that they do not insure Velocity Kits because they felt that
since they do not insure the plane when it is complete it was not fair to
insure the kit. This seems like a recent change on their part.
I was quoted for a $60K replacement cost kit, $600/yr by Falcon on the same
day (I'm instrument rated). Falcon suggested that I call Avemco because
they felt that Avemco could do a better price, but as it turns out, they
will not bother.
Today, I emailed Pam with all the particulars and I'm awaiting a response on
price.
Bob
-----Original Message-----
From: reflector-admin@tvbf.org [mailto:reflector-admin@tvbf.org]On Behalf Of
Milehitaz@aol.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 06, 2003 2:46 PM
To: reflector@tvbf.org
Subject: Re: REFLECTOR:More Insurance Woes
I am using Avemco for builders insurance. It runs me about 450 a year. Your
right, it's very strange that they will offer me the build Ins, and the
cheapest in the biz, but don't want me when it comes time to fly. Oh well.
Best to all,
Larry
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<DIV><SPAN class=229340120-06052003><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2> All,</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=229340120-06052003><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=229340120-06052003><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>The
seeming endless inconsistencies and disparities of insurance practices are
not really incongruent when you consider that "they just make up
the rules</FONT></SPAN><SPAN class=229340120-06052003><FONT face=Arial
color=#0000ff size=2> as they go along." Honest, no kidding.
Insurance underwriting and the weather have one thing in common; they change
daily...and usually for the worse. As Hytec45 mentioned, the insurance
companies took a whippin' on 9/11, and now we're the "whippees."
</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=229340120-06052003><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=229340120-06052003><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>It's
so darn complicated, but a Coop for hull insurance that was talked about in the
Newsletter really does make good sense. Hull insurance is a different
animal than liability insurance because hull damage is quantifiable and
estimable, unlike liability which only stops at the limits of a lawyer's
mind. </FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=229340120-06052003><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=229340120-06052003><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>I'm
not going to volunteer to set it up, but a non-profit Coop that charged
3-5% of the hull value and rebated the excess over the paid-loss experience (and
overhead), could end up providing hull insurance for an effective 1-2% of the
hull value.....which is something we could all live with. The loss
experience on the Velocity since the Factory started their Checkout and Aircraft
inspection program has improved markedly (at least according to anecdotal
comments in the Newsletter).</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=229340120-06052003><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=229340120-06052003><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>If
someone is brave enough (ne: stupid enough) to want to think about setting up a
Coop, I'd be willing to seriously consider putting in seed money. I
suspect that Velocity would be most helpful in establishing
a "relationship" to the factory for continued aircraft inspection and pilot
checkouts. Given the relatively low cost of repairing Velocities compared
to Kansas Cans after a fender-bender, there is little reason that hull insurance
should be 5% of the value of the plane....when we can even get it. If I
lived in FL close to the Factory, I'd try doing it tomorrow, but I don't, so I
won't, but that doesn't mean it's not a good idea for someone else that has time
on their hands, is organized, knows Velocities and is
hands-on.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=229340120-06052003><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=229340120-06052003><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2>Chuck</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=229340120-06052003><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=229340120-06052003><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Tahoma
size=2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> reflector-admin@tvbf.org
[mailto:reflector-admin@tvbf.org]<B>On Behalf Of </B>Andy
Millin<BR><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, May 06, 2003 3:36 PM<BR><B>To:</B>
reflector@tvbf.org<BR><B>Subject:</B> RE: REFLECTOR:More Insurance
Woes<BR><BR></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=929573419-06052003><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2>Bob,</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=929573419-06052003><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=929573419-06052003><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2>Funny, I JUST renewed my "Aircraft Under Construction" with
Avemco. It was $550/yr.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=929573419-06052003><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=929573419-06052003><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2>Andy</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Tahoma
size=2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> reflector-admin@tvbf.org
[mailto:reflector-admin@tvbf.org]<B>On Behalf Of </B>Bob
Hugel<BR><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, May 06, 2003 3:31 PM<BR><B>To:</B>
reflector@tvbf.org<BR><B>Subject:</B> RE: REFLECTOR:More Insurance
Woes<BR><BR></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN
class=105402619-06052003>Larry,</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=105402619-06052003>I
called Avemco on Thursday of last week to ask about Builders
Insurance. They told me that they do not insure Velocity Kits because
they felt that since they do not insure the plane when it is complete it was
not fair to insure the kit. This seems like a recent change on their
part.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN
class=105402619-06052003></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN class=105402619-06052003>I
was quoted for a $60K replacement cost kit, $600/yr by Falcon on the same
day (I'm instrument rated). Falcon suggested that I call Avemco
because they felt that Avemco could do a better price, but as it turns out,
they will not bother.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN
class=105402619-06052003></SPAN></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN
class=105402619-06052003>Today, I emailed Pam with all the particulars and
I'm awaiting a response on price.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2><SPAN
class=105402619-06052003>Bob</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE>
<DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Tahoma
size=2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> reflector-admin@tvbf.org
[mailto:reflector-admin@tvbf.org]<B>On Behalf Of
</B>Milehitaz@aol.com<BR><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, May 06, 2003 2:46
PM<BR><B>To:</B> reflector@tvbf.org<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: REFLECTOR:More
Insurance Woes<BR><BR></FONT></DIV><FONT face=arial,helvetica><FONT lang=0
face=Tahoma color=#0000ff size=3 FAMILY="SANSSERIF">I am using Avemco for
builders insurance. It runs me about 450 a year. Your right, it's very
strange that they will offer me the build Ins, and the cheapest in the
biz, but don't want me when it comes time to fly. Oh well. Best to
all,<BR>Larry</FONT>
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