REFLECTOR: GPS outage, no big deal

Sun Dec 2 12:50:45 CST 2012

Hi Scott,
I'm glad GPS jamming has had little affect on you. My point is it is out
there, and from indications a growing problem.
I hope the VOR/ILS system will be maintained indefinitely or until a long
term solution on this situation enters the equation. I had heard VOR/ILS
was being eyed for long-term phase out with GPS and WAAS to to take over.
I will be more interested in an EFIS that can perform an NDB triangulating
function as backup for GPS. I know Grand Rapids uses their AHRS using
electronic INAV as primary. That is reassuring.
Mark

On Sun, Dec 2, 2012 at 8:36 AM, Scott Derrick <scott at tnstaafl.net> wrote:

>  I've flown the route from Grants to Carlsbad over  a hundred times.
> Seeing a notam for GPS outage along my route was fairly common.  Out of the
> 20 or so instances I think I experienced an intermittent issue a couple
> times.  No big deal.  We do have VOR/ILS radios in both T210's as I do in
> my Velocity.
>
> It's a very rare occurrence and for 99% of us a non-issue.
>
> If you feel its an issue, install a VOR receiver in your panel! They are
> cheap and an easy install. I even carry a Icom handheld in case I loose the
> entire panel, and I has a VOR receiver in it. But its a PITA to navigate
> with it!
>
> Scott
>
> -------- Original Message --------
> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: NextGen NAV
> From: nmflyer1 at aol.com
> To: reflector at tvbf.org
> Date: 12/01/2012 08:36 PM
>
> They do that kind of jamming in white sands (Holloman AFB), and up by
> Pueblo Co. Sometimes, both at once. Many times they attempt to make the
> jamming directional (although they won't tell the general public that).
> They do this for target purposes as well as to minimize serious outages for
> the public. Sometimes, they just turn it on and jam everything.
> They do have to put a NOTAM out for it. The problem is, us controllers may
> not get the NOTAM on our "new and improved" system. Rather, if we get a few
> reports, we have to go digging to find out what is up.
> I have had FSS inform me of these NOTAMS when calling for a briefing.
> Sometimes on the computerized ones, they just don't show up.
>
> Best to always have a plan B... or C
>
> Kurt Winker
> Albuquerque Center.
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Mark Magee <edjonesbrady at gmail.com> <edjonesbrady at gmail.com>
> To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list <reflector at tvbf.org><reflector at tvbf.org>
> Sent: Sat, Dec 1, 2012 6:58 pm
> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: NextGen NAV
>
> Hi Bill,
> I posted about this in the past, it's probably in the archive: but to
> summarize I was making a leg from KDVT (Phoenix area) to my home in KBBD in
> central Texas in N34XL when I lost GPS halfway across southern New Mexico
> eastbound and had to dead reckon to beyond ELP, about 45 mins. I had just
> bought N34XL and was relocating it to my home, it only has GPS in the panel
> and I had a backup Nav  for my IPad, both went down. On with ELP APP I
> heard the controllers calling vectors for the SKED Airliners, and with SWAL
> B37 drivers responding to controllers that they had lost primary nav. As
> well I heard the controllers working F-18's, and finally after quite a
> while flying dead reckoning (sandwiched in a corridor inside Restricted
> Airspace) a controller on APP announced that GPS jamming was occurring in
> the area, with no known time at which it would stop. I was just south of
> White Sands NM when I lost GPS initially. I think I drove out of the
> jamming area and regained GPS about 35 NM east of ELP, probably 145nm
> without GPS.  Apparently US Military was conducting drills over White Sands
> and was jamming GPS. I'm glad is was CAVU that day.
> After this event, I reviewed this with a few B37 drivers at SWAL I know,
> and they said that if close to restricted airspace in certain parts of the
> country, GPS jamming is common. And the jamming spills out way beyond the
> perimeter of the Restricted airspace. So the more active military OPS and
> Restricted airspace you have in your local area the better chance you have
> of losing your GPS in flight.
> That's it in a nutshell.
>
> Mark
> On Sat, Dec 1, 2012 at 4:50 PM, Stockman, Bill <
> bill.stockman at daytonaero.com> wrote:
>
>> Mark
>>
>> I'm late to the discussion.   How did you know you were actually being
>> jammed?
>> ________________________________________
>> From: reflector-bounces at tvbf.org [reflector-bounces at tvbf.org] On Behalf
>> Of Mark Magee [edjonesbrady at gmail.com]
>> Sent: Saturday, December 01, 2012 3:20 PM
>> To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list
>> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: NextGen NAV
>>
>> On Dec 1, 2012, at 12:18 PM, James Lotspeich <jlotspeich34 at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> > On the flip side, GPS jamming is not exactly a common problem.
>>
>> True. Yet the fact it is so easily (and inexpensively) jammed is
>> concerning. The first time you encounter your own personal session of being
>> GPS jammed in-flight while PIC, behind  a panel with no VOR, NDB, ADF
>> installed it greatly changes your perspective. Having my GPS jammed for
>> almost 45 mins in-flight has turned me into an activist on this issue.
>>
>> Mark B. Magee
>> Sent from IPhone 4S
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>
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