REFLECTOR: Reflector Digest, Vol 89, Issue 112

Alex Balic velocity_pilot at verizon.net
Sat Aug 25 20:31:49 CDT 2012


If you are rolling left, then either put a washer in the upper bolt on the
right wing, or the lower bolt of the left wing- it will add right roll ( to
correct)  there could be a slight profile  difference that is causing more
lift on one wing than the other- should not take long to do it- you can use
"U" shaped shims to test, (so you don't have to remove the bolts) then
replace with washers when you get corrected.

 

From: reflector-bounces at tvbf.org [mailto:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org] On
Behalf Of Geoff Gerhardt
Sent: Saturday, August 25, 2012 6:19 PM
To: Jean Prudhomme; Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list
Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Reflector Digest, Vol 89, Issue 112

 

Jean,

 

Are you saying that you torqued the wing by only putting a washer in one
bolt location?  Because its a roll issue, not a yaw issue, I'm assuming I
should be looking for a incidence angle difference between them.  I thought
the best way to do this would be to use a digital inclinometer and compare
the angles of the trailing edges of the wings where there's a nice flat
surface.

 

Thanks for your help.

 

Geoff

On Sat, Aug 25, 2012 at 6:02 PM, Jean Prudhomme <prudhommejean at yahoo.com>
wrote:

As builder of several Velocity it,s happen a couple of time and i had to put
washer between spars at upper or lower bolt position to twist the wing and
finally have the correction done

 

JEAN PRUDHOMME

Sales Associate

 CANADA REALTY INC

POMPANO BEACH FLORIDA

Tel:754-366-1780

Toll free: 866-439-5011

http://jeanprudhomme.southfloridamls.com/

 

From: "reflector-request at tvbf.org" <reflector-request at tvbf.org>
To: reflector at tvbf.org 
Sent: Saturday, August 25, 2012 4:36 PM
Subject: Reflector Digest, Vol 89, Issue 112


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Today's Topics:

  1. Re:  4th test flight - roll tendency persists (steve korney)
  2.  Navy Man (Mark Magee)
  3. Re:  4th test flight - roll tendency persists (Richard J. Gentil)


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2012 20:15:03 +0000
From: steve korney <s_korney at hotmail.com>
To: Reflector Reflector <reflector at tvbf.org>
Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: 4th test flight - roll tendency persists
Message-ID: <SNT127-W21BE981B00B795ABE7E4B3E7BC0 at phx.gbl>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"


Geoff...

The ailerons are free floating... They should set themselves by aerodynamic
forces of airflow...When you let go of the stick, the ailerons should take a
position on their own and should be the same on both sides no matter what
the aircraft is doing... 


Steve 

From: lwcoen at hotmail.com
To: geoff.gerhardt at gmail.com; reflector at tvbf.org
Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2012 12:39:04 -0500
Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: 4th test flight - roll tendency persists






Geoff,

>From what you are describing it sounds like the ailerons are 
being deflected aerodynamically.  You might want to look at the bottom 
forward edge of the left aileron to see if it extends below the lower
surface of 
the wing when it?s held in the neutral position.  Since the ailerons are 
hinged at the top, any increase of drag on the left compared to the right
would 
cause the effect you're seeing.

Larry Coen
N136LC




From: Geoff Gerhardt 
Sent: Saturday, August 25, 2012 6:37 AM
To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list 

Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: 4th test flight - roll tendency 
persists

Alex/Steve, 


That was my first thought, too, but in order to get it to fly level, 
pressure on the stick is needed to keep the ailerons to neutral.  If I let 
the stick go, the left aileron wants to come up, right goes down.  If it 
were a wing shimming issue, I'd expect that the ailerons would need to be
pushed 
into a non-neutral position to counteract the effect of improperly aligned 
wings. 


Before flying the plane, my ailerons were positioned so that the trailing 
edges were level with the wings.  After the third flight when I noticed 
this left roll tendency, I adjusted them so they drooped ~1/8".  I think it 
helped a little, but did not eliminate the left roll tendency.


Geoff


On Fri, Aug 24, 2012 at 10:12 PM, Alex Balic <velocity_pilot at verizon.net>
wrote:


  
  
  Possibly 
  the wings need shimming
  
  
  From: reflector-bounces at tvbf.org [mailto:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org] On
Behalf Of Geoff 
  Gerhardt
Sent: Friday, August 24, 2012 7:38 PM
To: 
  Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list
  
Subject: REFLECTOR: 4th test flight - roll tendency 
  persists
  
  
  Guys,
  
  
  
  
  
  I went on my fourth test flight this afternoon.  Still 
  have butterflies before the flight and check things over like I have OCD
(yes, 
  the canard bolts are still there, for the fourth time...). 
  
  
  
  
  Dealing with a few issues now that I've left the pattern 
  and brought it up to speed.  I noticed on the third flight that it wants 
  to roll to the left.  This is not a yaw (ball's in the center), but a 
  definite roll that requires right pressure on the stick to fly level at
140kts 
  (more pressure for higher speed).  Aileron trim isn't enough to take it 
  out.  On that third flight, when I was flying level at 140ks by using 
  right stick pressure, when I looked back I could see that the trailing
edges 
  of both ailerons were a little higher than the wing.  So, before the 
  fourth flight, I drooped both down so they were ~1/8" below the wing (they

  were level before at rest), but this did not have much effect on the roll 
  tendency (although the ailerons were level or drooping at speed).  It 
  definitely seems to be an aileron issue.  When I'm flying level (using 
  right stick pressure), the ailerons seem to be in an equal position. 
  Letting the stick go, the right aileron comes up, left down and it 
  rolls.  Any other ideas on things to check?
  
  
  
  Slow flight went very well, nice control down to 60kts. 
  Easy 180 turn, then back the other way holding 
  altitude.
  
  
  
  Geoff
  
  




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Message: 2
Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2012 15:16:58 -0500
From: Mark Magee <edjonesbrady at gmail.com>
To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list <reflector at tvbf.org>
Subject: REFLECTOR: Navy Man
Message-ID: <5A62CBAF-9870-445E-9B44-FC70374835F4 at gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain;    charset=us-ascii

You guys know a Navy Man was the first one to step foot on the moon? 
No glass flight decks back then.
An era has ended.

Mark B. Magee
N34XL
Sent from IPhone 4


------------------------------

Message: 3
Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2012 16:35:58 -0400
From: "Richard J. Gentil" <richard at naples-air-center.com>
To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list <reflector at tvbf.org>
Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: 4th test flight - roll tendency persists
Message-ID:
    <F3674ACC-E17A-4F9C-9A53-0B42BE2FB26B at naples-air-center.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

Geoff,

I would look to the incident angle of your wings, the faster you go, the
pronounced the turning tendency will be. 

Richard 

Sent from my iPhone 4 Classic

On Aug 25, 2012, at 4:15 PM, steve korney <s_korney at hotmail.com> wrote:

> Geoff...
> 
> The ailerons are free floating... They should set themselves by
aerodynamic forces of airflow...When you let go of the stick, the ailerons
should take a position on their own and should be the same on both sides no
matter what the aircraft is doing... 
> 
> 
> 
> Steve 
> 
> From: lwcoen at hotmail.com
> To: geoff.gerhardt at gmail.com; reflector at tvbf.org
> Date: Sat, 25 Aug 2012 12:39:04 -0500
> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: 4th test flight - roll tendency persists
> 
> Geoff,
>  
> From what you are describing it sounds like the ailerons are being
deflected aerodynamically.  You might want to look at the bottom forward
edge of the left aileron to see if it extends below the lower surface of the
wing when it?s held in the neutral position.  Since the ailerons are hinged
at the top, any increase of drag on the left compared to the right would
cause the effect you're seeing.
>  
> Larry Coen
> N136LC
> 
> From: Geoff Gerhardt
> Sent: Saturday, August 25, 2012 6:37 AM
> To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list
> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: 4th test flight - roll tendency persists
> 
> Alex/Steve,
> 
> That was my first thought, too, but in order to get it to fly level,
pressure on the stick is needed to keep the ailerons to neutral.  If I let
the stick go, the left aileron wants to come up, right goes down.  If it
were a wing shimming issue, I'd expect that the ailerons would need to be
pushed into a non-neutral position to counteract the effect of improperly
aligned wings.  
> 
> Before flying the plane, my ailerons were positioned so that the trailing
edges were level with the wings.  After the third flight when I noticed this
left roll tendency, I adjusted them so they drooped ~1/8".  I think it
helped a little, but did not eliminate the left roll tendency.
> 
> Geoff
> 
> On Fri, Aug 24, 2012 at 10:12 PM, Alex Balic <velocity_pilot at verizon.net>
wrote:
> Possibly the wings need shimming
> 
>  
> 
> From: reflector-bounces at tvbf.org [mailto:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org] On
Behalf Of Geoff Gerhardt
> Sent: Friday, August 24, 2012 7:38 PM
> To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list
> 
> 
> Subject: REFLECTOR: 4th test flight - roll tendency persists
> 
>  
> 
> Guys,
> 
>  
> 
> I went on my fourth test flight this afternoon.  Still have butterflies
before the flight and check things over like I have OCD (yes, the canard
bolts are still there, for the fourth time...).  
> 
>  
> 
> Dealing with a few issues now that I've left the pattern and brought it up
to speed.  I noticed on the third flight that it wants to roll to the left.
This is not a yaw (ball's in the center), but a    definite roll that
requires right pressure on the stick to fly level at 140kts (more pressure
for higher speed).  Aileron trim isn't enough to take it out.  On that third
flight, when I was flying level at 140ks by using right stick pressure, when
I looked back I could see that the trailing edges of both ailerons were a
little higher than the wing.  So, before the    fourth flight, I drooped
both down so they were ~1/8" below the wing (they    were level before at
rest), but this did not have much effect on the roll tendency (although the
ailerons were level or drooping at speed).  It definitely seems to be an
aileron issue.  When I'm flying level (using right stick pressure), the
ailerons seem to be in an equal position.  Letting the stick go, the right
aileron comes up, l!
eft down and it rolls.  Any other ideas on things to check?
> 
>  
> 
> Slow flight went very well, nice control down to 60kts.  Easy 180 turn,
then back the other way holding    altitude.
> 
>  
> 
> Geoff
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> To change your email address, visit
http://www.tvbf.org/mailman/listinfo/reflector
> 
> Visit the gallery!  www.tvbf.org/gallery
> user:pw = tvbf:jamaicangoose
> Check new archives: www.tvbf.org/pipermail
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> _______________________________________________ To change your email
address, visit http://www.tvbf.org/mailman/listinfo/reflector Visit the
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archives: www.tvbf.org/pipermail Check old archives:
http://www.tvbf.org/archives/velocity/maillist.html
> _______________________________________________
> To change your email address, visit
http://www.tvbf.org/mailman/listinfo/reflector
> 
> Visit the gallery!  www.tvbf.org/gallery
> user:pw = tvbf:jamaicangoose
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