REFLECTOR: Pilots report cockpit power failures

Thu Aug 23 00:14:58 CDT 2012

Thing I heard most from A320 crews was. What's it doing? I don't know but
its doing it again.
On Aug 22, 2012 10:12 PM, <nmflyer1 at aol.com> wrote:

> The comment was made to illustrate how the airplane "thinks" or attempts
> to think. Not specifically addressing any particular incident. In terms of
> "normal" aircraft operations and performance, from a controllers & normal
> pilot's point of view... It just plain (plane) sucks.
>
>  Kurt Yes.. KURT  not Kert.
>
>  Good day,
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Glenn Falkenberg <airmech2 at gmail.com>
> To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list <reflector at tvbf.org>
> Sent: Wed, Aug 22, 2012 10:39 pm
> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Pilots report cockpit power failures
>
>  Kert the airplane was in normal law all the way down to the water. There
> was no loss of electrical systems or adiru's.  The pilot flying could have
> held the joy stick full aft and the airplane would have maintained pitch
> attitude and airspeed just above stall.
> On Aug 22, 2012 3:47 PM, <nmflyer1 at aol.com> wrote:
>
>> "Alternate Law"... that about sums it up.
>>
>>  Kurt
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Richard J. Gentil <richard at naples-air-center.com>
>> To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list <reflector at tvbf.org>
>> Sent: Wed, Aug 22, 2012 3:15 pm
>> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Pilots report cockpit power failures
>>
>>  Mark,
>>
>>  That is my understanding.
>>
>>  I own one of the few schools allowed to teach JAA/EASA professional
>> courses in the USA.
>>
>>  Europe is all about theoretical knowledge and our students are in a
>> Boeing or Bus at 250 hours, flying for a European airline where here in FAA
>> land it is all about practical experience and do not expect to be flying a
>> Boeing or Bus for a major airline till around 7,000 hours of flight
>> experience.
>>
>>  The design of aircraft use those philosophies. EU is all about
>> automation and taking as much of the pilot out of the loop as possible. The
>> US is all about the pilot.
>>
>>  Richard
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone 4 Classic
>>
>> On Aug 22, 2012, at 4:52 PM, Mark Magee <edjonesbrady at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>   Hi Richard,
>> I love the Reflector, I learned something new.
>> So correct me if I'm wrong, a software parameter prevented the flightcrew
>> from getting what thrust the engines could produce despite the damage, for
>> the program over-rode the throttle position asked for and selected FLIGHT
>> IDLE to prevent further damage? This is the same fly-by-wire bad
>> programming that sent that Airbus into the trees on a low pass at the Paris
>> Air Show years ago.
>> That almost cooked Sully's goose.
>>
>> Let me see if I can capture my thoughts on this;
>>
>> *'If it ain't Boeing, I ain't Going!'*
>>
>> I think that says it.
>>
>> Mark
>>
>>  On Wed, Aug 22, 2012 at 3:40 PM, Richard J. Gentil <
>> richard at naples-air-center.com> wrote:
>>
>>>  Mark,
>>>
>>>  The difference is with Airbus, if the A320 systems detect damage to an
>>> engine, the system takes the engine and puts it in idle not to further
>>> damage the engine. Boeing does not do this.
>>>
>>>  While the engines would develop anything close to full power with a
>>> B737 they would have been able to get enough thrust to make it to
>>> Teterboro.
>>>
>>>  If you listen to the CVR, Sully and Skiles spent most of their time to
>>> getting the engines out of idle before landing in the Hudson.
>>>
>>>  Richard
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone 4 Classic
>>>
>>> On Aug 22, 2012, at 4:29 PM, Mark Magee <edjonesbrady at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>   Hi Richard,
>>> I didn't know Rolls or GE had developed a Goose-Proof engine. Or rather
>>> a Flock-O-Geese-Proof engine.
>>> The Frogs tried the 'Foie Gras' engine which was a proven failure.
>>> Funny enough, with the Foie Gras you were supposed to be able to eat the
>>> goose after it passed through the engine. The engine was to literally cook
>>> your goose...
>>> Those Frogs! Had it only worked!
>>>
>>> Mark Magee
>>> N34XL
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, Aug 22, 2012 at 2:43 PM, Richard J. Gentil <
>>> richard at naples-air-center.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>>  Well if Sully had been flying a Boeing and not an Airbus, no one
>>>> would know his name.
>>>>
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>>
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