REFLECTOR: Reflector Digest, Vol 85, Issue 3 interior pictures

Mark Riley the_rileys1 at verizon.net
Mon Apr 2 21:31:04 CDT 2012


There are a bunch of interior pictures on my blog. Just check marksvelocity.blogspot.com

Mark
On Apr 2, 2012, at 5:54 PM, reflector-request at tvbf.org wrote:

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> Today's Topics:
> 
>   1. Re:  finished interior pictures (nmflyer1 at aol.com)
>   2.  Dynon fuel pressure (Scott Derrick)
>   3. Re:  Dynon fuel pressure (Doug Kanczuzewski)
>   4. Re:  Dynon fuel pressure (Brian Michalk)
>   5. Re:  Dynon fuel pressure (Scott Derrick)
>   6. Re:  Dynon fuel pressure (Brian Michalk)
> 
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Message: 1
> Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2012 13:23:40 -0400 (EDT)
> From: nmflyer1 at aol.com
> To: reflector at tvbf.org
> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: finished interior pictures
> Message-ID: <8CEDF0C7AC82C04-1FF4-54B7 at webmail-d159.sysops.aol.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> 
> 
> Doug, 
> 
> I can send you some this evening when I get home... If you still need them. 
> 
> Kurt 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Douglas Holub <douglas.holub at gmail.com>
> To: reflector <reflector at tvbf.org>
> Sent: Mon, Apr 2, 2012 9:14 am
> Subject: REFLECTOR: finished interior pictures
> 
> 
> I'm looking for some pictures of finished interiors to show my upholstery guys. I found a few on Velocity's website in the "used planes for sale" area. Can somebody point me to some more? 
> 
> Douglas Holub
> Flying since '09, finally putting the interior in
> 
> _______________________________________________
> o change your email address, visit http://www.tvbf.org/mailman/listinfo/reflector
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> ser:pw = tvbf:jamaicangoose
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> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 2
> Date: Mon, 02 Apr 2012 10:43:23 -0600
> From: Scott Derrick <scott at tnstaafl.net>
> To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list <reflector at tvbf.org>
> Subject: REFLECTOR: Dynon fuel pressure
> Message-ID: <4F79D72B.3030705 at tnstaafl.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
> 
> I'm having an issue of a false high fuel pressure readingon my Dynon EMS.
> 
> I came within minutes of removing the fuel pump to see if the high 
> pressure reg was dirty or the recirc outlet was clogged. A 5 hour job 
> just to uncover the pump?
> 
> I happened to be testing the installation of a replacement capacitive 
> fuel probe and noticed the fuel pressure was reading 10 psi and the 
> engine was off! I played around with re-grounding the sensor(Dynon has a 
> serious Achilles heal because they use ungrounded sensors) to see if 
> that would alleviate it but no joy.
> 
> Anybody else have this issue?
> 
> I'm thinking of switching to a GRT sensor as they are 1/2 to 1/4 the 
> price of Dynon's and most are grounded.
> 
> Scott
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 3
> Date: Mon, 2 Apr 2012 17:46:39 +0000
> From: Doug Kanczuzewski <doug at customstudio.com>
> To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list <reflector at tvbf.org>
> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Dynon fuel pressure
> Message-ID:
> 	<1965FCEAF15F5244BE6BA2516824A98A05EFE8F2 at fnf-ex-1.saxton.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> 
> NO put I have been having the problem with mine reading 20psi consistently too low.
> 
> Doug
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: reflector-bounces at tvbf.org [mailto:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org] On Behalf Of Scott Derrick
> Sent: Monday, April 02, 2012 9:43 AM
> To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list
> Subject: REFLECTOR: Dynon fuel pressure
> 
> I'm having an issue of a false high fuel pressure readingon my Dynon EMS.
> 
> I came within minutes of removing the fuel pump to see if the high 
> pressure reg was dirty or the recirc outlet was clogged. A 5 hour job 
> just to uncover the pump?
> 
> I happened to be testing the installation of a replacement capacitive 
> fuel probe and noticed the fuel pressure was reading 10 psi and the 
> engine was off! I played around with re-grounding the sensor(Dynon has a 
> serious Achilles heal because they use ungrounded sensors) to see if 
> that would alleviate it but no joy.
> 
> Anybody else have this issue?
> 
> I'm thinking of switching to a GRT sensor as they are 1/2 to 1/4 the 
> price of Dynon's and most are grounded.
> 
> Scott
> _______________________________________________
> To change your email address, visit http://www.tvbf.org/mailman/listinfo/reflector
> 
> Visit the gallery!  www.tvbf.org/gallery
> user:pw = tvbf:jamaicangoose
> Check new archives: www.tvbf.org/pipermail
> Check old archives: http://www.tvbf.org/archives/velocity/maillist.html
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 4
> Date: Mon, 02 Apr 2012 13:49:21 -0500
> From: Brian Michalk <michalk at awpi.com>
> To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list <reflector at tvbf.org>
> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Dynon fuel pressure
> Message-ID: <4F79F4B1.4040009 at awpi.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
> 
> Back in my instrumentation days, the classes taught that "grounding" is 
> really a misnomer.  There are two type of common voltage, referred to as 
> "ground."
> The first is power grounds.  This is for lights, motors, alternators and 
> that sort of stuff.  The other type is for instrumentation.  The sensor 
> either generates a small voltage potential, or somehow moderates a 
> voltage or current.
> 
> I hate grounded sensors.  They mix the power return path with my 
> sensitive acquisition system that I take great pains to keep noise 
> free.  When the mfg. provides these, they contaminate all sorts of 
> things causing ground loops, induced voltage, and possibly injected RF 
> noise.
> 
> I don't consider temperature probes where the body is grounded to the 
> engine case for example to be a problem.  In that case, the acquisition 
> sensor checks for a voltage drop across the temperature probe, which is 
> a high impedance sensor, and thus does not contaminate my sensitive 
> acquisition voltages.  It is still a current loop and that make it 
> susceptible to noise because the current that went from the acquisition 
> system to the probe, and into the engine case has to magically find its 
> way back to the acquisition system somehow.  The problem is that we 
> don't know the return path, and that's the problem.
> 
> Okay off my sandbox.  Can you put a voltmeter on the sensor?  Do you get 
> the same results with everything turned off except the Dynon?
> 
> On 4/2/2012 11:43 AM, Scott Derrick wrote:
>> I'm having an issue of a false high fuel pressure readingon my Dynon EMS.
>> 
>> I came within minutes of removing the fuel pump to see if the high 
>> pressure reg was dirty or the recirc outlet was clogged. A 5 hour job 
>> just to uncover the pump?
>> 
>> I happened to be testing the installation of a replacement capacitive 
>> fuel probe and noticed the fuel pressure was reading 10 psi and the 
>> engine was off! I played around with re-grounding the sensor(Dynon has 
>> a serious Achilles heal because they use ungrounded sensors) to see if 
>> that would alleviate it but no joy.
>> 
>> Anybody else have this issue?
>> 
>> I'm thinking of switching to a GRT sensor as they are 1/2 to 1/4 the 
>> price of Dynon's and most are grounded.
>> 
>> Scott
>> _______________________________________________
>> To change your email address, visit 
>> http://www.tvbf.org/mailman/listinfo/reflector
>> 
>> Visit the gallery!  www.tvbf.org/gallery
>> user:pw = tvbf:jamaicangoose
>> Check new archives: www.tvbf.org/pipermail
>> Check old archives: http://www.tvbf.org/archives/velocity/maillist.html
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 5
> Date: Mon, 02 Apr 2012 15:20:32 -0600
> From: Scott Derrick <scott at tnstaafl.net>
> To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list <reflector at tvbf.org>
> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Dynon fuel pressure
> Message-ID: <4F7A1820.1030200 at tnstaafl.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
> 
> I love grounded sensors and have used them in instrumentation for years 
> in avionics( Space3 Shuttle, B1-B, etc..) and commercial systems.  But I 
> expect that what ever I connect the sensor to, will provide me with the 
> sensor ground along side the data wire(amp. volt, freq., etc).
> 
> I completely agree that using power ground for sensors is B.A.D.
> 
> Now Dynon actually provides the ground connections on the EFIS and EMS 
> but then provides shitty cheap ungrounded(meaning the ground path is the 
> bus(power) ground. Then when you tell them your having problems they say 
> your ground path from the engine to the instrument is bad.
> 
> I swapped out the crappy Dynon provided ungrounded oil temp sensor which 
> was pathetically inaccurate, with a GRT grounded(ground lug on sensor 
> run to EMS) and now I get a smooth acurte reading unaffected by voltage 
> or amperage changes on the power bus.
> 
> VDO is the manufacturer of the fuel sensor sold by Dynon.  They make a 
> grounded sensor in the same PSI range, I need to find out if the 
> resistance is the same across its pressure range of 80 PSI.   Or install 
> a GRT grounded sensor, but that sensor is only rated to 30 PSI and my 
> system is capable of producing 32 PSI.  I think that would be OK but???
> 
> Scott
> 
> -------- Original Message --------
> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Dynon fuel pressure
> From: Brian Michalk <michalk at awpi.com>
> To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list <reflector at tvbf.org>
> Date: 04/02/2012 12:49 PM
> 
>> Back in my instrumentation days, the classes taught that "grounding" is
>> really a misnomer. There are two type of common voltage, referred to as
>> "ground."
>> The first is power grounds. This is for lights, motors, alternators and
>> that sort of stuff. The other type is for instrumentation. The sensor
>> either generates a small voltage potential, or somehow moderates a
>> voltage or current.
>> 
>> I hate grounded sensors. They mix the power return path with my
>> sensitive acquisition system that I take great pains to keep noise free.
>> When the mfg. provides these, they contaminate all sorts of things
>> causing ground loops, induced voltage, and possibly injected RF noise.
>> 
>> I don't consider temperature probes where the body is grounded to the
>> engine case for example to be a problem. In that case, the acquisition
>> sensor checks for a voltage drop across the temperature probe, which is
>> a high impedance sensor, and thus does not contaminate my sensitive
>> acquisition voltages. It is still a current loop and that make it
>> susceptible to noise because the current that went from the acquisition
>> system to the probe, and into the engine case has to magically find its
>> way back to the acquisition system somehow. The problem is that we don't
>> know the return path, and that's the problem.
>> 
>> Okay off my sandbox. Can you put a voltmeter on the sensor? Do you get
>> the same results with everything turned off except the Dynon?
>> 
>> On 4/2/2012 11:43 AM, Scott Derrick wrote:
>>> I'm having an issue of a false high fuel pressure readingon my Dynon EMS.
>>> 
>>> I came within minutes of removing the fuel pump to see if the high
>>> pressure reg was dirty or the recirc outlet was clogged. A 5 hour job
>>> just to uncover the pump?
>>> 
>>> I happened to be testing the installation of a replacement capacitive
>>> fuel probe and noticed the fuel pressure was reading 10 psi and the
>>> engine was off! I played around with re-grounding the sensor(Dynon has
>>> a serious Achilles heal because they use ungrounded sensors) to see if
>>> that would alleviate it but no joy.
>>> 
>>> Anybody else have this issue?
>>> 
>>> I'm thinking of switching to a GRT sensor as they are 1/2 to 1/4 the
>>> price of Dynon's and most are grounded.
>>> 
>>> Scott
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> To change your email address, visit
>>> http://www.tvbf.org/mailman/listinfo/reflector
>>> 
>>> Visit the gallery! www.tvbf.org/gallery
>>> user:pw = tvbf:jamaicangoose
>>> Check new archives: www.tvbf.org/pipermail
>>> Check old archives: http://www.tvbf.org/archives/velocity/maillist.html
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> To change your email address, visit
>> http://www.tvbf.org/mailman/listinfo/reflector
>> 
>> Visit the gallery! www.tvbf.org/gallery
>> user:pw = tvbf:jamaicangoose
>> Check new archives: www.tvbf.org/pipermail
>> Check old archives: http://www.tvbf.org/archives/velocity/maillist.html
>> 
> 
> -- 
> When one door of happiness closes, another opens; but often we look so 
> long at the closed door that we do not see the one which has been opened 
> for us.
> Helen Keller
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 6
> Date: Mon, 02 Apr 2012 16:59:38 -0500
> From: Brian Michalk <michalk at awpi.com>
> To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list <reflector at tvbf.org>
> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Dynon fuel pressure
> Message-ID: <4F7A214A.5010200 at awpi.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
> 
> Oh.  Actually we love the same thing.
> 
> Yes.  I agree.  For any sensor you give me, it needs a minimum of two 
> wires.  One for voltage reference (ground) the other for signal.
> 
> Using the chassey for signal return is asking for trouble.
> 
> On 4/2/2012 4:20 PM, Scott Derrick wrote:
>> I love grounded sensors and have used them in instrumentation for 
>> years in avionics( Space3 Shuttle, B1-B, etc..) and commercial 
>> systems.  But I expect that what ever I connect the sensor to, will 
>> provide me with the sensor ground along side the data wire(amp. volt, 
>> freq., etc).
>> 
>> I completely agree that using power ground for sensors is B.A.D.
>> 
>> Now Dynon actually provides the ground connections on the EFIS and EMS 
>> but then provides shitty cheap ungrounded(meaning the ground path is 
>> the bus(power) ground. Then when you tell them your having problems 
>> they say your ground path from the engine to the instrument is bad.
>> 
>> I swapped out the crappy Dynon provided ungrounded oil temp sensor 
>> which was pathetically inaccurate, with a GRT grounded(ground lug on 
>> sensor run to EMS) and now I get a smooth acurte reading unaffected by 
>> voltage or amperage changes on the power bus.
>> 
>> VDO is the manufacturer of the fuel sensor sold by Dynon.  They make a 
>> grounded sensor in the same PSI range, I need to find out if the 
>> resistance is the same across its pressure range of 80 PSI.   Or 
>> install a GRT grounded sensor, but that sensor is only rated to 30 PSI 
>> and my system is capable of producing 32 PSI.  I think that would be 
>> OK but???
>> 
>> Scott
>> 
>> -------- Original Message --------
>> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Dynon fuel pressure
>> From: Brian Michalk <michalk at awpi.com>
>> To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list <reflector at tvbf.org>
>> Date: 04/02/2012 12:49 PM
>> 
>>> Back in my instrumentation days, the classes taught that "grounding" is
>>> really a misnomer. There are two type of common voltage, referred to as
>>> "ground."
>>> The first is power grounds. This is for lights, motors, alternators and
>>> that sort of stuff. The other type is for instrumentation. The sensor
>>> either generates a small voltage potential, or somehow moderates a
>>> voltage or current.
>>> 
>>> I hate grounded sensors. They mix the power return path with my
>>> sensitive acquisition system that I take great pains to keep noise free.
>>> When the mfg. provides these, they contaminate all sorts of things
>>> causing ground loops, induced voltage, and possibly injected RF noise.
>>> 
>>> I don't consider temperature probes where the body is grounded to the
>>> engine case for example to be a problem. In that case, the acquisition
>>> sensor checks for a voltage drop across the temperature probe, which is
>>> a high impedance sensor, and thus does not contaminate my sensitive
>>> acquisition voltages. It is still a current loop and that make it
>>> susceptible to noise because the current that went from the acquisition
>>> system to the probe, and into the engine case has to magically find its
>>> way back to the acquisition system somehow. The problem is that we don't
>>> know the return path, and that's the problem.
>>> 
>>> Okay off my sandbox. Can you put a voltmeter on the sensor? Do you get
>>> the same results with everything turned off except the Dynon?
>>> 
>>> On 4/2/2012 11:43 AM, Scott Derrick wrote:
>>>> I'm having an issue of a false high fuel pressure readingon my Dynon 
>>>> EMS.
>>>> 
>>>> I came within minutes of removing the fuel pump to see if the high
>>>> pressure reg was dirty or the recirc outlet was clogged. A 5 hour job
>>>> just to uncover the pump?
>>>> 
>>>> I happened to be testing the installation of a replacement capacitive
>>>> fuel probe and noticed the fuel pressure was reading 10 psi and the
>>>> engine was off! I played around with re-grounding the sensor(Dynon has
>>>> a serious Achilles heal because they use ungrounded sensors) to see if
>>>> that would alleviate it but no joy.
>>>> 
>>>> Anybody else have this issue?
>>>> 
>>>> I'm thinking of switching to a GRT sensor as they are 1/2 to 1/4 the
>>>> price of Dynon's and most are grounded.
>>>> 
>>>> Scott
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> To change your email address, visit
>>>> http://www.tvbf.org/mailman/listinfo/reflector
>>>> 
>>>> Visit the gallery! www.tvbf.org/gallery
>>>> user:pw = tvbf:jamaicangoose
>>>> Check new archives: www.tvbf.org/pipermail
>>>> Check old archives: http://www.tvbf.org/archives/velocity/maillist.html
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> To change your email address, visit
>>> http://www.tvbf.org/mailman/listinfo/reflector
>>> 
>>> Visit the gallery! www.tvbf.org/gallery
>>> user:pw = tvbf:jamaicangoose
>>> Check new archives: www.tvbf.org/pipermail
>>> Check old archives: http://www.tvbf.org/archives/velocity/maillist.html
>>> 
>> 
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Visit the gallery!  tvbf:jamaicangoose
> 
> End of Reflector Digest, Vol 85, Issue 3
> ****************************************



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