REFLECTOR: Reflector: a current pic of my plane

Scott Derrick scott at tnstaafl.net
Tue Jan 27 20:26:05 CST 2009


Usually you measure oil temperature prior to the cooler.  Your 
interested in what is the temperature of it in the engine!

If the cooler can provide a 50 degree differential, and you measure 
after the cooler, a temp reading of 190, a reasonable temp, would really 
be 240 degrees, redline for my engine!

Certified airplanes have a green arc on the temp gauge for full power. 
I believe but would have to check to be sure that for a TSIO520 the low 
part of the arc is about 100 degrees,high end is 240.  Whats more 
important is pressure.  Continental believes if the oil is below 120 
degrees you may exceed redline oil pressure at full rpm and blow out a 
crankshaft seal.

Whatever engine you are using it's operating handbook will give you the 
lowest temp you may use at full power.

But that assumes your measuring the temp of the oil in the engine, 
before the cooler.

Scott

aminetech at bluefrog.com wrote:
> Scott,
> 
> My oil temp sensor is after the cooler.  Are you saying that when I begin to see the temp rise, that the engine is warm enough for full power?  My manual specifies 104F oil temp before applying full power.
> 
> John
> SERG Franklin/IVO
> 
> --- scott at tnstaafl.net wrote:
> 
> From: Scott Derrick <scott at tnstaafl.net>
> To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list <reflector at tvbf.org>
> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Reflector: a current pic of my plane
> Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2009 14:06:27 -0700
> 
> Doesn't the franklin circulate oil like most other IC engines???
> 
> there is a temperature controlled valve called a vernatherm valve which 
> is closed when the engine is cold causing almost all the oil to 
> circulate  within the engine.  Once the temperature rises to a set 
> level, usually around 180F, it opens to allow a regulated amount of the 
> oil to flow through a cooler. This valve regulates the oil temperature.
> 
> The oil in the cooler/cabin heater may take a while to heat up, but the 
> oil in the engine should not take 20 minutes.  Once you apply full power 
> it should heat up rapidly to 180 degrees.
> 
> Air flow is a funny thing.  Think of it as trying to push a rope.  Not 
> an easy thing to do, while pulling a rope is.
> 
> Creating a low pressure differential in the exit area pulls the 
> air(rope) through as you found.
> 
> I also have two oil coolers in series. The first from the engine is 
> mounted in the cabin that cabin air can circulate through or dump the 
> heated air overboard. The air is moved with a fan. The second cooler is 
> the standard nose mounted cooler. I removed the air plumbing that could 
> direct the heated air into the cabin and it now just dumps it overboard, 
> below and behind the cooler.
> 
> I was hoping to not have to put a bypass valve on the nose cooler in 
> order to get oil hot enough to heat the cabin.  Since my cabin 
> heater(oil cooler) recirculates the cabin air I think it will work well. 
>   The original design of using the nose mounted cooler, heating outside 
> air up from below zero temps, to 80-100 degrees just never worked for 
> me.  If you fly in Florida it probably works fine.
> 
> Scott
> 
> Jerry Teitsma wrote:
>> I have fought oil temperature problems since first flying my Franklin 
>> powered Velocity.  I used a NACA scoop in front with an oil cooler emptying 
>> into a collector box, then dumping out the bottom or directed to the inside. 
>> I couldn't get enough cooling so I added a second oil cooler - also in 
>> front - with a second NACA scoop both dumping in the same heat box.  Now it 
>> appears that I can't get the air out of the collector box fast enough.  It 
>> builds up pressure and leaks around the connections, making the cabin too 
>> hot and I am not getting adequate cooling.
>>
>> My long hoses, two oil coolers and an oil filter makes for a long wait for 
>> oil temps to rise before take-off.  In our cold climate, this can take 20 
>> minutes.  It has been suggested that I install a valve that allows 
>> circumventing the lines to the front to get oil back to the engine faster. 
>> Perhaps instead, I should install the second oil cooler back in the engine 
>> compartment or in the wing and install it in parallel rather than in series 
>> as is currently the case.  Any comments?  Thanks, JT
>>
>> Jerry Teitsma
>> Granby CO
>>
>> jerryteits at comcast.net
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: <reflector-request at tvbf.org>
>> To: <reflector at tvbf.org>
>> Sent: Tuesday, January 27, 2009 11:00 AM
>> Subject: Reflector Digest, Vol 56, Issue 69
>>
>>
>>> Send Reflector mailing list submissions to
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>>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>>> than "Re: Contents of Reflector digest..."
>>>
>>>
>>> Today's Topics:
>>>
>>>   1. Re:  A CURRENT PIC OF MY PLANE (steve korney)
>>>   2. Re:  Parking Brake (David Ullman)
>>>   3.  This product is a winner for the traveler (Jim Agnew)
>>>
>>>
>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>> Message: 1
>>> Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2009 22:14:57 +0000
>>> From: steve korney <s_korney at hotmail.com>
>>> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: A CURRENT PIC OF MY PLANE
>>> To: Reflector Reflector <reflector at tvbf.org>
>>> Message-ID: <BAY108-W2545454ED305479433BE03E7CA0 at phx.gbl>
>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"
>>>
>>>
>>> Hi Jon...
>>>
>>> Are you having oil temp problems or just looking to move the scoop to 
>>> another location...?
>>>
>>> Best... Steve
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2009 14:56:03 -0700
>>> From: dennis.doc at gmail.com
>>> To: reflector at tvbf.org
>>> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: A CURRENT PIC OF MY PLANE
>>>
>>> Here are photos of my application for twin radiators (one in each wing) 
>>> for my Chevy V-6 application. Here you only see the scoop used on the 
>>> bottom of the wing. Air enters the wing at 30 degrees and exits from top 
>>> of wing with another scoop facing aft. This is Alan Shaw's design for oil 
>>> cooler as adapted by Malcolm Collier for my plane. I carved them out of 
>>> blue foam and laid up two ply of bid - then filled with balloon. Perhaps 
>>> it will help with your oil cooler.
>>>
>>>
>>> Best,
>>> Dennis Martin
>>>
>>> On Mon, Jan 26, 2009 at 2:17 PM, Jeff Howell <jeffreyhowell at hotmail.com> 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I will send you more pics of the wing. there is an oil cooler through the 
>>> wing utilizing 2 naca vents one on top one on bottom. I do not have any 
>>> drawings but you might be able to get Alan Shaw to get you the drawings. I 
>>> believe it is his design but I am not sure... Thanx Jeff
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> From: jbachman at zianet.com
>>> To: reflector at tvbf.org
>>> Date: Fri, 23 Jan 2009 10:20:01 -0700
>>> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: A CURRENT PIC OF MY PLANE
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> What's in the right wing near the root?  Is that the outlet for a rear oil 
>>> cooler?  I have one mounted in the bottom of the engine cowl and am 
>>> looking at moving it.  Do you have any drawings or other info on your 
>>> installation (if it is an oil cooler) that you can send me?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Jon Bachman
>>> Std RG
>>> N956DR
>>> 575 430-9724
>>>
>>> jbachman at zianet.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> From: reflector-bounces at tvbf.org [mailto:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org] On 
>>> Behalf Of Jeff Howell
>>>
>>> Sent: Monday, January 05, 2009 5:17 PM
>>> To: reflector at tvbf.org
>>> Subject: REFLECTOR: A CURRENT PIC OF MY PLANE
>>>
>>>
>>> HERE ARE A FEW PICS OF MY PLANE... I PLAN ON FLYING IN ABOUT 3 MONTHS OR 
>>> SO... IT IS COMING ALONG!
>>>
>>>
>>> JEFF
>>> N223AZ
>>> STD RG
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Send e-mail anywhere. No map, no compass. Get your Hotmail? account now.
>>>
>>> Windows Live? Hotmail??more than just e-mail.  See how it works.
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>>
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>>>
>>> -- 
>>> All the best,
>>>
>>> Dennis
>>>
>>> _________________________________________________________________
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>>> ------------------------------
>>>
>>> Message: 2
>>> Date: Mon, 26 Jan 2009 19:59:16 -0800
>>> From: "David Ullman" <ullman at robustdecisions.com>
>>> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Parking Brake
>>> To: <reflector at tvbf.org>
>>> Message-ID: <6852A82EC7D24F84A12A04239D6968B1 at david>
>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>>>
>>> Thanks for all the replies on the Parking Brake question.  I will be 
>>> putting
>>> one my Velocity (the one supplied by Aircraft Spruce).  Not that expensive
>>> and seems a nice feature to have.
>>>
>>> David G. Ullman PhD ME
>>> Robust Decisions
>>> ullman at robustdecisions.com
>>> 541-754-3609
>>>
>>>
>>> __________ Information from ESET Smart Security, version of virus 
>>> signature
>>> database 3802 (20090126) __________
>>>
>>> The message was checked by ESET Smart Security.
>>>
>>> http://www.eset.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------
>>>
>>> Message: 3
>>> Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2009 07:12:23 -0800 (PST)
>>> From: Jim Agnew <jim_agnew_2 at yahoo.com>
>>> Subject: REFLECTOR: This product is a winner for the traveler
>>> To: Velocity Reflector <reflector at tvbf.org>
>>> Message-ID: <906871.8301.qm at web30803.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Hi All,
>>>
>>> Pass this on to all of your traveling friends, good price to!
>>>
>>> Traveling today with all of the electronics (PCs, cameras, Ipods, 
>>> MP3players, cell phones, Etc)?and chargers is a real pain. Additionally 
>>> you cannot usually find enough outlets and you have no idea about the 
>>> voltage regulation especially on board ships.? I purchased one of these 
>>> before our 3 1/2 week trip in December and it was very handy.? It is for 
>>> 120V only but sure solves the outlet problem.? All you need carry now for 
>>> the 5 volt charging is the necessary USB cable and no charger.?
>>>
>>> Please see the following site.
>>>
>>> ?http://www.buy.com/prod/belkin-mini-surge-protector-with-usb-charging/q/loc/101/208173205.html?adid=17653&dcaid=17653
>>> ?
>>> ?
>>> Sincerely,
>>> ?
>>> Jim
>>> ?
>>> James F. Agnew
>>> Jim_Agnew_2 at Yahoo.Com
>>> Tampa, FL
>>> Velocity 173 Elite Aircraft Completed & Flying
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>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Visit the gallery!  tvbf:jamaicangoose
>>>
>>> End of Reflector Digest, Vol 56, Issue 69
>>> ***************************************** 
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> _______________________________________________
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> 
> 
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