REFLECTOR: Ivo and Vesta
Scott Derrick
scott at tnstaafl.net
Mon Apr 27 16:36:37 CDT 2009
I used a Catto fixed pitch on a IO360, and loved it. Cept for the long
take off rolls at high density altitude airports. At sea level take off
performance was great.
Scott
Leslie Huttunen wrote:
> I am considering a prop change from the MT that I use on a STD-RG with
> an IO360 and would be very interested to know if anyone is using an
> IVO on an IO360, and if so, 1) how may hours they have on the
> IVO-IO360 combination, 2) what their maintenance related issues have
> been, and 3) what you experience with take off and cruise performance
> (even best guesses would be helpful and much appreciated).
>
> Thanks very much,
>
> Leslie Huttunen
>
> On Apr 26, 2009, at 7:30 AM, <aminetech at bluefrog.com>
> <aminetech at bluefrog.com> wrote:
>
>> Here's the post by "Chuck" <c.harbert at comcast.net> that I was
>> referring to.
>>
>> John
>>
>> I know Ivo will sell you a prop for Lyc 6's because I have one, and
>> recently
>> bought parts for it. I'm not aware of any insurance problem with an
>> IVO prop
>> when I've renewed my policy.
>>
>> He won't sell you parts for a Lyc 4 cylinder because of a V crash
>> several
>> years ago. The owner who had lots of "help" building his plane later
>> had a
>> problem with the pitch motor, so he dismantled the prop enroute.
>> Instead of
>> following the tightening sequence (4 retightenings over a couple hours)
>> which is absolutely critical (and well known), he was in a hurry and
>> took
>> off with his family onboard. Shortly afterward he started getting a
>> vibration and advised the tower that he would see if it would go away
>> instead of landing imediately. The blades separated from the hub and all
>> perished. There was speculation that the powerful firing pulses every
>> 180
>> degrees of the 4 cyl. causes too much load for the clamping strength
>> of the
>> IVO, but there are other V's that have successfully used an IVO on
>> their Lyc
>> 4's for a long time.
>>
>> An Ivo is a less expensive (< $4K) in-flight adjustable pitch prop that
>> works on twisting the carbon fiber reinforced blades to change pitch.
>> Some
>> people have said that this is not an efficient way to change pitch,
>> but it
>> does work. The blades are very strong and seem to work well in a pusher
>> configuration. He has been making props for a long time particularly for
>> ultralights.
>>
>> I'm sure some of the Franklin guys can tell us what they think of their
>> IVO's.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --- amillin at sbcglobal.net wrote:
>>
>> From: "Andy Millin" <amillin at sbcglobal.net>
>> To: "'Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list'" <reflector at tvbf.org>
>> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Ivo and Vesta
>> Date: Sat, 25 Apr 2009 18:54:49 -0400
>>
>> John,
>>
>> There are several people running an Ivo on a 6 cylinder Franklin. I
>> have never heard of anyone running an Ivo on a 6 cylinder Lycoming.
>>
>> That being said, the 360 Lycoming has a greater negative pulse in its
>> 720 degree cycle than the 540 does. Even though it has more torque,
>> it is technically smoother power. Still, never heard of Ivo selling
>> one for a 540.
>>
>> Andy
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: reflector-bounces at tvbf.org [mailto:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org]
>> On Behalf Of aminetech at bluefrog.com
>> Sent: Friday, April 24, 2009 9:12 AM
>> To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list
>> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Ivo and Vesta
>>
>> I recall someone on the list has an IVO on a 6 cyl lycoming. IMO,
>> IVO is being over conservative, or perhaps their insurance is the
>> reason.
>>
>> John
>>
>> --- scott at tnstaafl.net wrote:
>>
>> From: Scott Derrick <scott at tnstaafl.net>
>> To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list <reflector at tvbf.org>
>> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Ivo and Vesta
>> Date: Thu, 23 Apr 2009 17:14:39 -0600
>>
>> Kurt,
>>
>> I wonder whats the difference in power pulses between a Chevy V6
>> and a Continental flat 6? Why does one hammer a prop and the other not?
>>
>> Scott
>>
>> nmflyer1 at aol.com wrote:
>>> Mike,
>>>
>>> That is good to hear! After asking me tons of questions and carefully
>>> considering my setup, IVO said they would provide me a prop that would
>>> meet my needs. I have a 76" Magnum CS. I have not put it on yet
>>> because I want to get my painting done first.
>>>
>>> In fact, IVO Co. called me a while back just to make sure I was happy
>>> with the prop.. and I have had it on the shelf for years!.
>>>
>>> Hopefully it will be the right setup for my powerplant and provide me
>>> service like yours.
>>>
>>> Kurt
>>> 340HP Aluminum 4.3L V-6
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Michael Watson <mikewatsspg at gmail.com>
>>> To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list <reflector at tvbf.org>
>>> Sent: Thu, 23 Apr 2009 11:53 am
>>> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Ivo and Vesta
>>>
>>> I've been running a IVO Magnum Electric Constant speed prop on a
>>> Franklin (Std Elite RG) for ten years plus. Sent back twice for
>>> check up
>>> and refreshing. They are tough as nails, handles FOD well and as long
>>> as Ivo's maintenance instructions are followed, seems to last
>>> thousands
>>> of hours.
>>>
>>> On Thu, Apr 23, 2009 at 8:27 AM, Andy Millin <amillin at sbcglobal.net
>>> <mailto:amillin at sbcglobal.net>> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hey Larry,
>>>
>>> Believe it or not, I did a fair amount of research on the Ivo. I
>>> wanted to use the Ivo. I gave the guy a call and we spoke for
>>> nearly an hour.
>>>
>>> Way back in the day Mark Machado had mounted an Ivo on a standard
>>> with an IO-360. He was VERY impressed with the performance. I
>>> believe the write up was in Velocity Views. It sounded like it
>>> was going to be better than sliced bread AND peanut butter. It is
>>> a real performer, great price, etc.
>>>
>>> Ivos blades are very light. The prop is amazingly light. This
>>> is a blessing and a curse. The prop does not have enough mass to
>>> absorb the significant torque thrashing a big bore aircraft engine
>>> produces. In his own words you could see the prop was just being
>>> tortured. At low RPM it was possible to see the blades flexing
>>> length wise as the amazing shear forces were hitting the base.
>>>
>>> The blades are tough and as far as I know they never failed. What
>>> did happen was the blades would shift at the base. They would
>>> work their way free from the bolts. Ivo compensated with a very
>>> specific torquing regimen combined with stainless steel foil
>>> marking tape on the seams. I believe this worked. However not
>>> all users of the prop were as vigilant or patient as they needed
>>> to be.
>>>
>>> I believe Ivo called for torque the bolts, run the engine,
>>> re-torque the bolts, re-run the engine, repeat until the torque
>>> does not change between cycles.
>>>
>>> In 1997, Mark Ewart and his family were killed (Standard Velocity
>>> DMO-266). Please read the report yourself:
>>> http://tinyurl.com/dhok3m It was RELATED to the Ivo. The detail
>>> related to the Prop is on the second page. Reading the whole
>>> report is better.
>>>
>>> In the end Ivo decided to stop fighting with big bore aircraft
>>> engines and their violent torque curves. His props really can
>>> withstand 750 HP, you just have to h ave a relatively smooth power
>>> curve. Ivo has been a very good option for guys like Chris Barber
>>> running a rotary with reduction unit. Smooth.
>>>
>>> It works on the Franklin as a 6 cylinder 360 has smoother power
>>> curve than 4 cylinder 360.
>>>
>>> As for the Vesta. If you want to read back in the Archives, I was
>>> one of the first, possibly even the first from the Velocity
>>> community to speak with Jason Day. Jason is a very nice guy. I
>>> had acted as a bit of a liaison to get him to work with Velocity
>>> to develop a prop for us and have Velocity test the thing.
>>>
>>> A major portion of Jasons business is automotive conversions for
>>> aircraft. His props have been running by-and-large on automotive
>>> engines with reduction units on them read smooth power curve.
>>>
>>> Jasons stuff looks great. I believe he has the background and
>>> skills to make a great prop. Problem is, he didnt have ANY
>>> experience with our prop running on an aircraft engine. Velocity
>>> wanted to help, but were unwilling to risk Turbo Charlie $200K+
>>> aircraft and a pilot on a completely untested prop.
>>>
>>> Velocity suggested that Jason give the prop to testers in the
>>> Airboat industry and let them beat on it for a year. I dont
>>> believe Jason was willing and Im pretty sure this has never been
>>> done.
>>>
>>> Bob Buls owns one of Jasons props. Bob is also going to run it
>>> with one of Jasons automotive conversions.
>>>
>>> Dave Dent has a prop and has been working with Jason on it. I
>>> sincerely wish Dave the best of luck on his flight testing and am
>>> eager to hear his findings. This could be a great new option for
>>> us.
>>>
>>> The other concern on the Vesta is the weight. It is a heavy
>>> prop. I believe it might weigh 50 to 100% more than the MT or
>>> Aero Composite.
>>>
>>> Please form your own opinions based on your own direct research.
>>> For my soft pink body, Ill wait for someone else to strap one on
>>> and hit the wild blue.
>>>
>>> Andy
>>>
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>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Mike W.
>>> 1997 Velocity Elite RG
>>> Franklin /IVO Electric CS
>>> Dual GRT EFIS Synthetic Vision
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>>
>>
>>
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>
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