REFLECTOR: On factory interaction with builders

Wed Mar 14 11:54:22 CDT 2007

Good Point!

________________________________

From: reflector-bounces at tvbf.org on behalf of bdtopp at comcast.net
Sent: Wed 3/14/2007 10:33 AM
To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list
Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: On factory interaction with builders

So the point being...  If you want to do less work, you will need to spend more money.  There's nothing magical about that.  When I purchased my kit 6 yrs ago, there was nothing even close to the a Velocity in a 4 place airplane that had their price/performance point.  For me that was the determining factor.  I personally think the Velocity is a good compromise between price and the amount of work you need to perform on parts/componets shipped from the factory.  If it wasn't for Velocity, I would of built a two place airplane based soley on my budget at the time.

Bruce Topp

	-------------- Original message -------------- 
	From: "Tom Martino" <tmartino at troubleshooter.com> 

	> Good observation but not necessarily accurate. If you compare apples 
	> with apples, the increased cost of the kits pays off when it comes to 
	> the "end game". Because they are more "standard" and have a better 
	> overall "fit" and quality ... the final assembly and finishing touches 
	> go faster and easier. The Velocity will require a lot of 
	> "customization" and "one-up" type of stuff that adds up quickly. 
	> 
	> -----Original Message----- 
	> From: reflector-bounces at tvbf.org [mailto:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org] On 
	> Behalf Of Lawrence Epstein,MD 
	> Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2007 8:34 AM 
	> To: 'Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list' 
	> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: On factory interaction with buil! ders > 
	> IMHO, you are comparing apples and oranges. 
	> Van's are Metal aircraft and the fit & finish are variable, but 
	> different. 
	> 
	> Lancair is a composite aircraft which I admit the current fleet is 
	> easier & therefore possibly more likely to have a finer fit & finish 
	> than the Velocity, it is also $39,500 for the least expensive (current) 
	> model (2 seats FG Legacy). The 4 seat ES is $82,500. If you compare the 
	> Velocity to the Lancair 360 & 320, I think that the finished product 
	> compares favorably. 
	> 
	> Larry Epstein 
	> 
	> -----Original Message----- 
	> From: reflector-bounces at tvbf.org [mailto:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org] On 
	> Behalf Of Tom Martino 
	> Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2007 9:26 AM 
	> To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list 
	> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: On factory interaction with builders 
	> 
	> What y! ou say is technically true ... but when you compare Velocity with 
	> Van and Lancair ... the company and factory fails by comparison. I can 
	> say this from personal experience based on my business dealings with 
	> professional builders. And after seeing other kits from the ground up. 
	> 
	> The "other" kit manufacturers I mention have more consistency, 
	> owner/builder communication, overall quality and a more reliable fleet. 
	> 
	> Oh, I know, I will be criticized for my views. And I will hear from the 
	> "Velocity can do no wrong" club ... but instead of being blinded by our 
	> love for the plane (yes, I still love my Velocity) we need to open our 
	> eyes to reality. 
	> 
	> There have been numerous occasions where the factory had no idea how to 
	> answer a question or solve a particular issue ... even though I knew 
	> other builders had the same questions or issues. 
	> 
	> The compa! ny does not seem to build on past experience and the wealth of 
	> knowledge accumulated from their customer base. 
	> 
	> In short, I think finished Velocities in general, lack the finish, trim 
	> and reliability of other kits planes. When you see an outstanding 
	> Velocity, it stands out. It is outstanding in spite of the factory -- 
	> not because of it. 
	> 
	> Tom Martino 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> 
	> -----Original Message----- 
	> From: reflector-bounces at tvbf.org [mailto:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org] On 
	> Behalf Of Ron Brown 
	> Sent: Wednesday, March 14, 2007 5:40 AM 
	> To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list 
	> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: On factory interaction with builders 
	> 
	> These are after all, homebuilt aircraft. Velocity Aircraft Inc. 
	> provides us 
	> with a pile of parts - it is our responsibility to turn it into an 
	> airplane, 
	> to fly it,! and to maintain them. It is our airplane that the FAA 
	> certifies. 
	> 
	> Since there are over 300 (or is it over 400 now?) of us Velocity 
	> aircraft 
	> manufacturers - it would be impossible for VA, Inc to keep up with 
	> everything that we are want to incorporate or enhance. 
	> 
	> I think we manufacturers should do a better job of informing the other 
	> manufacturers of any problems we are encountering. The Reflector is an 
	> outstanding way to do this - we just need to do a better job. Surely 
	> somebody else saw the note about the problem with the cylinders and 
	> could 
	> have told us about it. 
	> 
	> Scott B. has been very patient with us manufacturers. I know Duane has 
	> had 
	> many heart burns over the criticism the factory receives over just about 
	> 
	> anything - starting with Velocity Views or a disagreement because 
	> certain 
	> builder enhance! ments h aven't been universally incorporated and 
	> backfitted to 
	> all previous kits. 
	> 
	> Brian Michalk has even been burned at the stake numerous times for his 
	> very 
	> generous hosting of the Reflector. Unfortunately, some of our fellow 
	> manufacturers have departed the Reflector over the harsh responses to 
	> some 
	> of their questions or suggestions. Some of us just have never heard the 
	> 
	> word TACT! The Reflector is NOT the creation or responsibility of VA, 
	> Inc. 
	> 
	> Thank you Scott B for your EXTREME patience! 
	> 
	> Ronnie Brown 
	> A VERY satisfied customer of a pile of parts - which now a GREAT 
	> airplane - 
	> because I manufactured it, I fly it, and I maintain it. 
	> EAA Technical Counselor & Flight Advisor 
	> 
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