No subject
Sun Dec 16 17:37:43 CST 2007
=0A=
=0A=
The recent messages on this list (for which I warmly thank you) made me swi=
tch my vague opinion to a Lyc 200HP engine. Would an MT propeller work fin=
e with it? I'd like to keep things simple and safe for this airplane, and =
I saw lots of complaints on propellers on this list. I wouldn't mind picki=
ng a fixed pitch propeller either (to be honest, in our club we only have f=
ixed pitch propellers, so I have close to no experience with variable pitch=
ones).=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
Grigore=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
On Feb 4, 2008 11:33 AM, Lawrence J. Epstein, MD <ljepstein at hotmail.com> wr=
ote:=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
It all depends on your time frame. If you are a year out from engine instal=
l, then you have more options. =0A=
Soon after delivery of the 1st production run, DH will have a "Firewall for=
ward (back)" kit available for the Velocity, which according to Doug (who I=
spent about an Hour on the phone with a few months ago), should be very co=
mplete. Therefore, I wouldn't expect it to be a whole lot more "experimenta=
l" than the Lycosaurus. =0A=
=0A=
The first production run (awaiting delivery) includes many velocity builder=
s (not to mention all the prototype work to date), so there should be good =
experience by the time your engine would be delivered.=0A=
=0A=
If you need an engine in the next 12-18 months, then I would go with the Ly=
co.=0A=
=0A=
Larry Epstein=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
-----Original Message-----
From: reflector-bounces at tvbf.org [mailto:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org] On Beh=
alf Of Grigore Rosu=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
Sent: Monday, February 04, 2008 10:59 AM
To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: tools, tools, and tools again=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
Dear Larry,=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
I was and still am a strong supporter of DH engines. When I ordered my kit=
, I was 100% sure that I'd install a DH engine in my airplane. In the mean=
while though, after realizing how much time everything takes, I changed my =
mind and decided to go for a standard and well-tested configuration. There=
are many much more experienced builders than me who would be happy to go f=
or an inovation like that, because they have a much beter big-picture than =
I do.=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
My hidden (from wife) plan is to finish this SEFG and then, while flying it=
, to start building a new Velocity airplane, "the airplne of my drams", tha=
t time as an "experienced" builder. That will definitely have a diesel eng=
ine (also, I intend to eventually move back to Europe, where diesel is a lo=
t cheaper).=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
Grigore=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
On Feb 4, 2008 8:16 AM, Lawrence J. Epstein, MD <ljepstein at hotmail.com> wro=
te:=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
Since you the have the luxury of some time before you make an engine choice=
(I lead a very luxurious life, I started my project 12 =BD years ago), you=
should at least take a close look at the Deltahawk diesel. With any luck, =
the production engines will be delivered and flying by the time you are rea=
dy. I won't go in to the advantages here (many pages of discussion in the a=
rchives as well as their web page), but it has been engineered & tested pri=
marily on a Velocity and as Avgas gets more problematic, a diesel looks mor=
e & more advantageous.=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
Larry Epstein=0A=
173 FGE=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
-----Original Message-----
From: reflector-bounces at tvbf.org [mailto:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org] On Beh=
alf Of Grigore Rosu
=0A=
Sent: Monday, February 04, 2008 8:59 AM
To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list
Subject: REFLECTOR: tools, tools, and tools again=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
Dear Reflectorists,=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
Thank you everybody for the valuable input on tools and the engine. Follow=
ing your advise, I'll most likely go with the Lycoming 200HP, when the time=
comes. My original 160HP choice was based exclusively on range, but I see=
the points you made, so probably in this case less range is OK for the inc=
rease in power. I would still be grateful for an answer on the prop arc di=
ameter ... or is the general advice to use a little cap chain and not worry=
about positioning?=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
Regarding tools, I have just made another order with Aircraft Spruce; anoth=
er $200. I think I spent close to $2,000 so far on tools; I had almost no =
tools when I started my project.=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
For those who are just starting their project, please do not underestimate:=
=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
1) the number and cost of tools that you will need for your airplane; bette=
r be realistic than have surprizes. Of course, if you can borrow tools fr=
om a friend or another Velocity builder that is great; but I am totally iso=
lated in a university city (Urbana-Champaign) and my friends only know how =
to write computer programs and solve mathematical equations; never heard of=
something called "pipe flaring" :-)=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
2) the amount of extra-, initially unexpected time you'll need to spend scr=
atching your head or waiting for tools/materials. Give each subproject a g=
enerous estimate, then triple that. I started fitting the pilot side lower=
strake on January 18 and I was convinced that I would close the top strake=
by the end of January if I give it all my time/energy. There were the "un=
expected" fuel senders, which slowed me down a few good days: "unexpected" =
because they were not even mentioned in the manual, and slowed me down beca=
use I had to order and wait for them, then learn how to install, ask, etc. =
Well, now is Feb 4 and I still have to wait for the "unexpected" finger st=
rainers, the AN fittings needed for the change in plans, etc. Assuming I r=
eceive these by Thursday and did not forget to order some important little =
thing which will delay me one more week, then I may have a chance to close =
the strake by the end of the week, say Feb 10. Applying the reasoning abov=
e, that probably means Feb 18 or so, making it about 1 month of work for on=
e strake only. There is this Jeffco thing, though, which I have never work=
ed with and which has no proper webpage with detailed explanations on how t=
o use; I can only optimistically hope that there will be no other "unexpect=
ed" issues with it ... though there always were ...=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
Grigore=0A=
=0A=
=0A=
_______________________________________________
To change your email address, visit http://www.tvbf.org/mailman/listinfo/re=
flector
=0A=
Visit the gallery! www.tvbf.org/gallery
user:pw =3D tvbf:jamaicangoose
Check new archives: www.tvbf.org/pipermail
=0A=
Check old archives: http://www.tvbf.org/archives/velocity/maillist.html=0A=
=0A=
_______________________________________________
To change your email address, visit http://www.tvbf.org/mailman/listinfo/re=
flector
=0A=
Visit the gallery! www.tvbf.org/gallery
user:pw =3D tvbf:jamaicangoose
Check new archives: www.tvbf.org/pipermail
=0A=
Check old archives: http://www.tvbf.org/archives/velocity/maillist.html=0A=
=20
_______________________________________________
To change your email address, visit http://www.tvbf.org/mailman/listinfo/re=
flector
=0A=
Visit the gallery! www.tvbf.org/gallery
user:pw =3D tvbf:jamaicangoose
Check new archives: www.tvbf.org/pipermail
=0A=
Check old archives: http://www.tvbf.org/archives/velocity/maillist.html
=0A=
--_2a3b0a0d-a917-49fd-8b7b-3c2f57c7f2ac_
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<body class=3D'hmmessage'><div style=3D"text-align: left;">Relative to buil=
ding an aircraft, it aint such a big deal ;-).<br><br>I believe it may be c=
onsidered a "major change" and in that case you need to make a log entry an=
d you may even need to log some flight test time (I would check with my FSD=
O as policy seems to vary from location to location). If you have a "loss" =
without doing the above, your insurance may not cover you.<br><br>My though=
ts are the same. I was thinking to use a Felix Prop initially and then swit=
ch to a CS when I re-charge my batteries ($$$). This way, I have a spare pr=
op if it is needed.<br><br>Larry Epstein<br></div><br><br><br><blockquote><=
hr id=3D"EC_stopSpelling">Date: Mon, 4 Feb 2008 16:01:01 -0600<br>From: gri=
gore.rosu at gmail.com<br>To: reflector at tvbf.org<br>Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: en=
gine size & CS prop<br><br><div>Greg,</div>=0A=
<div> </div>=0A=
<div>How dificult/expensive would it be to transit from a fixed pitch =
to a CS propeller? In other words, suppose that in order to get quick=
ly in the air, one chooses a fixed pitch propeller (assuming they are =
easier to get, though I'm not sure about that; they are obviously cheper th=
ough). Then in 2-3 years, suppose that one realizes that on=
e would really like to have a CS prop. Is it difficult/expensive=
to switch? My question is probably very silly; I really have never i=
nstalled a prop. I'm just looking for options.</div>=0A=
=0A=
<div> </div>=0A=
<div>Best,</div>=0A=
<div>Grigore<br><br></div>=0A=
<div class=3D"EC_gmail_quote">On Feb 4, 2008 3:28 PM, Greg Poole <<a hre=
f=3D"mailto:greg at pooledresources.com.au">greg at pooledresources.com.au</a>>=
; wrote:<br>=0A=
<blockquote class=3D"EC_gmail_quote" style=3D"border-left: 1px solid rgb(20=
4, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;">=0A=
<div lang=3D"EN-AU">=0A=
<div>=0A=
<span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">For the same reas=
ons I gave for going with the bigger engine, I would =96 if the budget allo=
ws it =96 then go with a constant speed prop. I believe it is generally ack=
nowledged that a correctly set up CS prop will enable you a much wide=
r performance envelope than what is possible going fixed pitch and will con=
sequently get you up to flying speed much faster than most fixed pitches wh=
ich tend to compromise one end or the other (usually both!).</span><B=
R>=0A=
=0A=
<span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><BR>=
=0A=
<span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);">While the factory=
has favoured MT props to date, they are not universally popular amongst Ve=
locity drivers due to high service and purchase cost and very soft blades w=
hich have proven easily damaged=85as a consequence, many of us await report=
s on other brands such as Vesta (how's it going Dave Dent?) and the one Mil=
t is promoting=85. </span><BR>=0A=
=0A=
<span style=3D"font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><BR>=
=0A=
<b><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; color: rgb(64, 0, 128);">Greg in Sydney<=
/span></b><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"></span><BR>=0A=
<span style=3D"font-size: 7.5pt; color: blue;"> </span><span style=3D"=
font-size: 10pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"><a href=3D"mailto:greg at pooledres=
ources.com.au"><span style=3D"font-size: 7.5pt;">greg at pooledresources.com.a=
u</span></a></span><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);=
"> </span><span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"></span><BR>=0A=
=0A=
<span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><BR>=0A=
<span style=3D"color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"> </span><span style=3D"font-s=
ize: 11pt; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);"></span><BR>=0A=
<div style=3D"border-style: solid none none; border-color: rgb(181, 196, 22=
3) -moz-use-text-color -moz-use-text-color; border-width: 1pt medium medium=
; padding: 3pt 0cm 0cm;">=0A=
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt;" lang=3D"EN-US">From Grigore Rosu<br><br></=
span><BR></div>=0A=
<div>=0A=
The recent messages on this list (for which I warmly thank you) made me swi=
tch my vague opinion to a Lyc 200HP engine. Would an MT propelle=
r work fine with it? I'd like to keep things simple and safe for this=
airplane, and I saw lots of complaints on propellers on this list. I=
wouldn't mind picking a fixed pitch propeller either (to be honest, in our=
club we only have fixed pitch propellers, so I have close to no experience=
with variable pitch ones).<BR>=0A=
</div>=0A=
<div>=0A=
<BR></div>=0A=
<div>=0A=
Grigore<BR></div>=0A=
<div>=0A=
<br><br> <BR></div>=0A=
<div>=0A=
On Feb 4, 2008 11:33 AM, Lawrence J. Epstein, MD <<a href=3D"mailto:ljep=
stein at hotmail.com">ljepstein at hotmail.com</a>> wrote:<BR>=0A=
<div>=0A=
<div>=0A=
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; color: navy;" lang=3D"EN-US">It all depends=
on your time frame. If you are a year out from engine install, then you ha=
ve more options. </span><span lang=3D"EN-US"></span><BR>=0A=
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; color: navy;" lang=3D"EN-US">Soon after del=
ivery of the 1<sup>st</sup> production run, DH will have a "Firewall forwar=
d (back)" kit available for the Velocity, which according to Doug (who I sp=
ent about an Hour on the phone with a few months ago), should be very compl=
ete. Therefore, I wouldn't expect it to be a whole lot more "experimental" =
than the Lycosaurus. </span><span lang=3D"EN-US"></span><BR>=0A=
=0A=
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; color: navy;" lang=3D"EN-US">The first prod=
uction run (awaiting delivery) includes many velocity builders (not to ment=
ion all the prototype work to date), so there should be good experience by =
the time your engine would be delivered.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"></span>=
<BR>=0A=
=0A=
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; color: navy;" lang=3D"EN-US">If you need an=
engine in the next 12-18 months, then I would go with the Lyco.</span><spa=
n lang=3D"EN-US"></span><BR>=0A=
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; color: navy;" lang=3D"EN-US"> </span><=
span lang=3D"EN-US"></span><BR>=0A=
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; color: navy;" lang=3D"EN-US">Larry Epstein<=
/span><span lang=3D"EN-US"></span><BR>=0A=
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; color: navy;" lang=3D"EN-US"> </span><=
span lang=3D"EN-US"></span><BR>=0A=
<div>=0A=
<span style=3D"font-size: 10pt;" lang=3D"EN-US">-----Original Message-----<=
br><b>From:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org">reflector-bou=
nces at tvbf.org</a> [mailto:<a href=3D"mailto:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org">ref=
lector-bounces at tvbf.org</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Grigore Rosu</span><BR>=0A=
</div>=0A=
<div>=0A=
<b><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt;" lang=3D"EN-US">Sent:</span></b><span st=
yle=3D"font-size: 10pt;" lang=3D"EN-US"> Monday, February 04, 2008 10:59 AM=
<br><b>To:</b> Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list</span><BR></div>=
=0A=
<div>=0A=
<div>=0A=
<b><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt;" lang=3D"EN-US">Subject:</span></b><span=
style=3D"font-size: 10pt;" lang=3D"EN-US"> Re: REFLECTOR: tools, tools, an=
d tools again</span><BR></div></div>=0A=
<div>=0A=
<div>=0A=
<p style=3D"margin-left: 36pt;"><span lang=3D"EN-US"> </span></p>=0A=
<div>=0A=
<p style=3D"margin-left: 36pt;"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Dear Larry,</span></p>=
</div>=0A=
<div>=0A=
<p style=3D"margin-left: 36pt;"><span lang=3D"EN-US"> </span></p></div=
>=0A=
<div>=0A=
<p style=3D"margin-left: 36pt;"><span lang=3D"EN-US">I was and still am a s=
trong supporter of DH engines. When I ordered my kit, I was 100% sure=
that I'd install a DH engine in my airplane. In the meanwhile though=
, after realizing how much time everything takes, I changed my mind and dec=
ided to go for a standard and well-tested configuration. There are ma=
ny much more experienced builders than me who would be happy to go for an i=
novation like that, because they have a much beter big-picture than I do.</=
span></p>=0A=
</div>=0A=
<div>=0A=
<p style=3D"margin-left: 36pt;"><span lang=3D"EN-US">My hidden (from wife) =
plan is to finish this SEFG and then, while flying it, to start building a =
new Velocity airplane, "the airplne of my drams", that time as an "experien=
ced" builder. That will definitely have a diesel engine (also, I inte=
nd to eventually move back to Europe, where diesel is a lot cheaper).</span=
></p>=0A=
</div>=0A=
<div>=0A=
<p style=3D"margin-left: 36pt;"><span lang=3D"EN-US"> </span></p></div=
>=0A=
<div>=0A=
<p style=3D"margin-left: 36pt;"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Grigore</span></p></di=
v>=0A=
<div>=0A=
<p style=3D"margin-left: 36pt;"><span lang=3D"EN-US"><br> </span></p><=
/div>=0A=
<div>=0A=
<p style=3D"margin-left: 36pt;"><span lang=3D"EN-US">On Feb 4, 2008 8:16 AM=
, Lawrence J. Epstein, MD <<a href=3D"mailto:ljepstein at hotmail.com">ljep=
stein at hotmail.com</a>> wrote:</span></p>=0A=
<div>=0A=
<div>=0A=
<p style=3D"margin-left: 36pt;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; color: navy=
;" lang=3D"EN-US">Since you the have the luxury of some time before you mak=
e an engine choice (I lead a very luxurious life, I started my project 12 =
=BD years ago), you should at least take a close look at the Deltahawk dies=
el. With any luck, the production engines will be delivered and flying by t=
he time you are ready. I won't go in to the advantages here (many pages of =
discussion in the archives as well as their web page), but it has been engi=
neered & tested primarily on a Velocity and as Avgas gets more problema=
tic, a diesel looks more & more advantageous.</span><span lang=3D"EN-US=
"></span></p>=0A=
=0A=
<p style=3D"margin-left: 36pt;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; color: navy=
;" lang=3D"EN-US"> </span><span lang=3D"EN-US"></span></p>=0A=
<p style=3D"margin-left: 36pt;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; color: navy=
;" lang=3D"EN-US">Larry Epstein</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"></span></p>=0A=
<p style=3D"margin-left: 36pt;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; color: navy=
;" lang=3D"EN-US">173 FGE</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"></span></p>=0A=
<div>=0A=
<div>=0A=
<p style=3D"margin-left: 36pt;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt; color: navy=
;" lang=3D"EN-US"> </span><span lang=3D"EN-US"></span></p>=0A=
<p style=3D"margin-left: 72pt;"><span style=3D"font-size: 10pt;" lang=3D"EN=
-US">-----Original Message-----<br><b>From:</b> <a href=3D"mailto:reflector=
-bounces at tvbf.org">reflector-bounces at tvbf.org</a> [mailto:<a href=3D"mailto=
:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org">reflector-bounces at tvbf.org</a>] <b>On Behalf O=
f </b>Grigore Rosu<br>=0A=
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, February 04, 2008 8:59 AM<br><b>To:</b> Velocity Aircr=
aft Owners and Builders list<br><b>Subject:</b> REFLECTOR: tools, tools, an=
d tools again</span><span lang=3D"EN-US"></span></p>=0A=
<p style=3D"margin-left: 72pt;"><span lang=3D"EN-US"> </span></p>=0A=
<div>=0A=
<p style=3D"margin-left: 72pt;"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Dear Reflectorists,</s=
pan></p></div>=0A=
<div>=0A=
<p style=3D"margin-left: 72pt;"><span lang=3D"EN-US"> </span></p></div=
>=0A=
<div>=0A=
<p style=3D"margin-left: 72pt;"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Thank you everybody fo=
r the valuable input on tools and the engine. Following your advise, =
I'll most likely go with the Lycoming 200HP, when the time comes. My =
original 160HP choice was based exclusively on range, but I see the points =
you made, so probably in this case less range is OK for the increase in pow=
er. I would still be grateful for an answer on the prop arc diameter =
... or is the general advice to use a little cap chain and not worry about =
positioning?</span></p>=0A=
</div>=0A=
<div>=0A=
<p style=3D"margin-left: 72pt;"><span lang=3D"EN-US"> </span></p></div=
>=0A=
<div>=0A=
<p style=3D"margin-left: 72pt;"><span lang=3D"EN-US">Regarding tools, I hav=
e just made another order with Aircraft Spruce; another $200. I think=
I spent close to $2,000 so far on tools; I had almost no tools when I star=
ted my project.</span></p>=0A=
</div>=0A=
<div>=0A=
<p style=3D"margin-left: 72pt;"><span lang=3D"EN-US"> </span></p></div=
>=0A=
<div>=0A=
<p style=3D"margin-left: 72pt;"><span lang=3D"EN-US">For those who are just=
starting their project, please do not underestimate:</span></p></div>=
=0A=
<div>=0A=
<p style=3D"margin-left: 72pt;"><span lang=3D"EN-US"> </span></p></div=
>=0A=
<div>=0A=
<p style=3D"margin-left: 72pt;"><span lang=3D"EN-US">1) the number and=
cost of tools that you will need for your airplane; better be realistic th=
an have surprizes. Of course, if you can borrow tools from a fr=
iend or another Velocity builder that is great; but I am totally isolated i=
n a university city (Urbana-Champaign) and my friends only know how to writ=
e computer programs and solve mathematical equations; never heard of someth=
ing called "pipe flaring" :-)</span></p>=0A=
</div>=0A=
<div>=0A=
<p style=3D"margin-left: 72pt;"><span lang=3D"EN-US"> </span></p></div=
>=0A=
<div>=0A=
<p style=3D"margin-left: 72pt;"><span lang=3D"EN-US">2) the amount of extra=
-, initially unexpected time you'll need to spend scratching your head or w=
aiting for tools/materials. Give each subproject a generous =
;estimate, then triple that. I started fitting the pilot si=
de lower strake on January 18 and I was convinced that I would close the to=
p strake by the end of January if I give it all my time/energy. There=
were the "unexpected" fuel senders, which slowed me down a few good days: =
"unexpected" because they were not even mentioned in the manual, and slowed=
me down because I had to order and wait for them, then learn how to instal=
l, ask, etc. Well, now is Feb 4 and I still have to wait for the "une=
xpected" finger strainers, the AN fittings needed for the change in plans, =
etc. Assuming I receive these by Thursday and did not forget to order=
some important little thing which will delay me one more week, then I may =
have a chance to close the strake by the end of the week, say Feb 10. =
Applying the reasoning above, that probably means Feb 18 or so, making it =
about 1 month of work for one strake only. There is this Jeffco thing=
, though, which I have never worked with and which has no proper webpage wi=
th detailed explanations on how to use; I can only optimistically hope that=
there will be no other "unexpected" issues with it ... though there a=
lways were ...</span></p>=0A=
</div>=0A=
<div>=0A=
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