REFLECTOR: barn door speed brake

Mon Oct 9 05:04:46 CDT 2006

For anyone who has the XL-RG-5 and is considering a speed brake, know
that all the "stuff" that has to go into the drop-down keel on the dash
5 version does not allow a normal install of the speedbrake mechanism.
I had to go w/ a 4 inch jackscrew over the 6 inch one, and had to attach
the jackscrew at a point forward of the mid point on the bellyboard
itself.  My extension angle is about 47 degrees instead of the 55 or so
the normal install.  If I used the 6 inch jackscrew in the kit the board
went out to 90 degrees.  Five inch JS would have been perfect, but none
are made.
Terry

-----Original Message-----
From: reflector-bounces at tvbf.org [mailto:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org] On
Behalf Of David Ullman
Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 1:50 PM
To: reflector at tvbf.org
Subject: REFLECTOR: barn door speed brake

I am building an Se and flew in one the other day that did not have a
speed brake.  The owner said the Duane Swing had told him no to bother.
The plane landed fine.  Do those of you who have one use it?  It is
worth the effort to install?

Dr. David G. Ullman
Robust Decisions Inc
1655 NW Hillcrest Drive
Corvallis, Oregon, 97330 USA
Phone 541-758-5088
Direct Phone: 541-754-3609
FAX 866-898-1007
ullman at robustdecisions.com

-----Original Message-----
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Behalf Of reflector-request at tvbf.org
Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 10:00 AM
To: reflector at tvbf.org
Subject: Reflector Digest, Vol 29, Issue 12

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Today's Topics:

   1. Re:  Winglet trimming (Andrew Ellzey)
   2. Re:  painting fuselage (Dave Black)
   3. Re:  Winglet trimming (Jack Prock)
   4. Re:  Canard incidence (Al Gietzen)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Sat, 7 Oct 2006 21:46:48 -0500
From: "Andrew Ellzey" <ajlz72756 at yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Winglet trimming
To: "Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list" <reflector at tvbf.org>
Message-ID: <007b01c6ea84$0123bda0$8302a8c0 at DASINC>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
	reply-type=original

Steve,

You should call the factory to let them know that there is a problem
with 
their winglet template and get an conformation to what I did for mine. I
am 
also building my wings and winglets. I had the same issue as you are
talking

about. Put your winglet back in the billet half that matches the inboard

side of the winglet. Mark the lines on the billet half, the 28" mark
will 
fall on the billet half and the 12" will fall on your winglet. Now mark
the 
1" foam trim line on your winglet per the manual. This line will fall 
entirely on your winglet. Sand your billet half to match the contour of
the 
trailing edge where the line comes off the foam of the winglet. Line you

billet half with plastic to make a mold half for your lay-up. Do your 
inboard lay-up per the manual leaving enough cloth for the entire size
per 
the manual. When you put your winglet in your billet half it will form
your 
trailing edge for the correct 28". After it cures you will trim the foam

back the 1" on your winglet per manual, and this line will fall on the
foam.

The manual also doesn't tell you what to do with the top of the winglet,

leave it squared off like it came out of the billet or round it off. I 
rounded mine off to a nice aerodynamic shape. There are now three of us
on 
the Reflector that has found the same issue, there probably will be
more.

Andy Ellzey

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Steve Goldman" <steve at fatcatair.com>
To: <reflector at tvbf.org>
Sent: Saturday, October 07, 2006 6:58 PM
Subject: REFLECTOR: Winglet trimming

> Well this might be a factory question for monday but we'll see.
>
> I got the winglets out of their billets today in hopes of starting on
> them.
> I got stymied almost immediately. The manual calls for marking a spot
28" 
> from
> the leading edge at the bottom and 12" at the top and trim to the line

> connecting
> those marks. Well I have more than 12" of foam at the top but I only
have 
> 27.5"
> at the bottom. So I'm not sure what to do. The manual does say the 
> important
> thing is for them to be as identical as you can do them and since both
are

> 27.5"
> I could make them match up.
>
> I took out the wing trimming template to see what the winglet foam 
> looked
> like
> next to it and they look short there too. (The curve on the inboard
side 
> looks
> remarkably different too but the geometry when it lays on the wing
could 
> be
> part of it.)
>
> --
> Steve Goldman
> '77 Tiger N28531
> Velocity XL5-RG (T-3465hrs 1%)
> Pittsboro, NC (9NC8)
> _______________________________________________
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> 

------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Sat, 07 Oct 2006 23:54:21 -0400
From: Dave Black <dvblack at comcast.net>
Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: painting fuselage
To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list <reflector at tvbf.org>
Message-ID: <4528766D.7060203 at comcast.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed

Brian,

>>I hired a professional auto painter to do my Velocity. He showed me 
>>many
>>tricks with the sanding. And he stressed the importance of lots of 
>>airflow to prevent paint dust from settling back on the plane.
>>  
> Why is it important to keep the dust off the plane?

We're talking about during painting. The airborne paint 'dust' would 
fall onto the still wet paint surface and dull the finish. Nothing you 
couldn't sand out, but still a lot of work. Having lots of cross-flow 
ventilation prevents that.

Dave

------------------------------

Message: 3
Date: Sat, 7 Oct 2006 22:59:32 -0700
From: "Jack Prock" <jackprock at comcast.net>
Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Winglet trimming
To: "Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list" <reflector at tvbf.org>
Message-ID: <094601c6ea9e$ecd56c20$c801a8c0 at jaxwindows>
Content-Type: text/plain;	charset="iso-8859-1"

Steve,

Andy Ellzey and I both had the same issue. I would think the factory
would update the manual, but they seem slow to do that even when several
people have the same problem over and over.

I asked the EXACT SAME question on the reflector on 7/30... if you go
back, you will see the chat. I will give you the response that Andy sent
me when I asked the question. His is a much better explanation than I
can do:

>> I had the same issue as you are talking about. Put your winglet back 
>>in the billet half that matches the inboard side of the winglet. Mark
the lines on the billet half, the 28" mark
>>will fall on the billet half and the 12" will fall on your winglet. 
>>Now
mark the 1" foam trim line on your winglet
>>per the manual. This line will fall entirely on your winglet. Sand 
>>your
billet half to match the contour of the trailing
>>edge where the line comes off the foam of the winglet. Line you billet
half with plastic to make a mold half for your
>>lay-up. Do your inboard lay-up per the manual leaving enough cloth for

>>the
entire size per the manual. When you put
>>your winglet in your billet half it will form your trailing edge for 
>>the
correct 28". After it cures you will trim the foam
>>back the 1" on your winglet per manual, and this line will fall on the
foam. The manual also doesn't tell you what
>>to do with the top of the winglet, leave it squared off like it came 
>>out
of the billet or round it off. I rounded mine
>>off to a nice aerodynamic shape. If you have room to attach your wings

>>to
the spar when you are ready to attach
>>your winglets, as the manual suggests, this is the best way to make 
>>sure
your winglets and wings are completely
>>matched. Make all of the cross check measurements the manual calls 
>>for. I
used a water level at the wing tips to
>>level both wings attached to the spar. I spent 2 full days getting
everything just right, I'm hoping this will payoff in
>>how my aircraft flies.

I followed this and my winglets came out great. Hope this helped.

Jack Prock

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Steve Goldman" <steve at fatcatair.com>
To: <reflector at tvbf.org>
Sent: Saturday, October 07, 2006 4:58 PM
Subject: REFLECTOR: Winglet trimming

> Well this might be a factory question for monday but we'll see.
>
> I got the winglets out of their billets today in hopes of starting on
them.
> I got stymied almost immediately. The manual calls for marking a spot 
> 28"
from
> the leading edge at the bottom and 12" at the top and trim to the line
connecting
> those marks. Well I have more than 12" of foam at the top but I only 
> have
27.5"
> at the bottom. So I'm not sure what to do. The manual does say the
important
> thing is for them to be as identical as you can do them and since both

> are
27.5"
> I could make them match up.
>
> I took out the wing trimming template to see what the winglet foam 
> looked
like
> next to it and they look short there too. (The curve on the inboard 
> side
looks
> remarkably different too but the geometry when it lays on the wing 
> could
be
> part of it.)
>
> --
> Steve Goldman
> '77 Tiger N28531
> Velocity XL5-RG (T-3465hrs 1%)
> Pittsboro, NC (9NC8)
>
>

------------------------------

Message: 4
Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2006 07:38:55 -0700
From: "Al Gietzen" <ALVentures at cox.net>
Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Canard incidence
To: "'Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list'"
	<reflector at tvbf.org>
Message-ID: <000501c6eae7$7b940140$6400a8c0 at BigAl>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Canard incidence

HI AL

The factory advised us to use two mixing sticks under the wingco canard
gage on our XL.

Mack  

Hi, Mack;

Can you tell me more specifically where/how you placed the sticks.  It
will give me a better idea of how much of a change may be necessary. Two
sticks is about 1/8".  And where did you place the gauge?  With the
varying camber from center to tip, there is only one place where the
gauge fits the coutour.  On mine it was about 2' in from the outboard
end.

When I was installing the canard some years ago, I spoke with both Alan
and Mark Machado at Velocity, and neither suggested anything different
about the use of the incidence gauge.

Thanks,

Al

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