REFLECTOR: Elevator Trim Spring

Alex Balic alex157 at pwhome.com
Mon Jan 30 17:49:21 CST 2006


How about just adjusting the incidence of the canard- not making it
adjustable, just changing it fro this particular aircraft- seems like it
might be a tad out of whack......

-----Original Message-----
From: reflector-bounces at tvbf.org [mailto:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org] On
Behalf Of Scott Derrick
Sent: Monday, January 30, 2006 3:12 PM
To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list
Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Elevator Trim Spring

This is what Beech did to the Starship and it help bankrupt the project.

There is a huge difference between an articulating tail(non-lifting) 
surface on a conventional aircraft and an articulating lifting surface.

Scott

Andy Millin wrote:
> I suppose you could if you wanted to experiment.
>
> I'm not an aerodynamic engineer.  Just some thoughts.
>
> It would make it difficult to seal the doghouse.  Would be cold and windy.
>
> Would need to find a way to attach and balance the whole canard.  Attach
> points would probably need to go right about where the middle of the spar
> cap is now.  But, you could find a new attach if you wanted to work at it.
>
> Would be quite a bit of mass to move around with the controls.
>
> The canard provides a significant amount of the lift.  Small changes in
> incidence would probably translate into large changes in pitch.  Would
want
> to have plenty of mechanical advantage to keep it from slamming to the
> stops.
>
> If you screw it up, you'll probably only get one chance at it.
>
> Not my cup of tea.
>
> Andy
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: reflector-bounces at tvbf.org [mailto:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org] On
> Behalf Of Andrew Ellzey
> Sent: Monday, January 30, 2006 2:55 PM
> To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list
> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Elevator Trim Spring
>
>
> Just a thought for everyone, not that we need to reinvent the wheel. Why 
> couldn't the angle of attack of the canard be made adjustable for trim,
just
>
> like Mooney's tails are made to pivot for pitch trim. There isn't any 
> additional drag induced at any trim settings with the Mooney's tail 
> configuration.
>
> Andy
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Scott Derrick" <scott at tnstaafl.net>
> To: "Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list" <reflector at tvbf.org>
> Sent: Monday, January 30, 2006 1:02 PM
> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Elevator Trim Spring
>
>
>   
>> John,
>>
>> I wasn't suggesting you use a shim block, you get to do whatever you 
>> want
>> to. though I got the idea from a factory A&P.
>>
>> I was asking Ron why he chose to move the actuator when adding a shim
>> block seems much simpler and accomplishes the same thing in my mind. 
>> Maybe I'm missing some aspect that moving the actuator accomplishes?
>>
>> Scott
>>
>> John Dibble wrote:
>>     
>>> Ronnie,
>>>
>>> I'm sorry, but I'm getting more confused.  My problem is that I don't
>>> have enough down
>>> (elevator up) trim at cruise.  I can see how moving the actuator forward

>>> could help
>>> this problem.  I don't understand why I need to cut the bracket.  Can't
I
>>>       
>
>   
>>> simply move
>>> it forward and make new holes in the canard?  I didn't build so maybe 
>>> that is why I
>>> don't understand.
>>>
>>> Scott D - I think your idea of the block is going to send me in the 
>>> wrong
>>> direction.
>>> Appreciate your help here.
>>>
>>> John
>>>
>>> Ron Brown wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>       
>>>> Morning John,
>>>>
>>>> No, lets try again.
>>>>
>>>> The objective is to move the actuator forward a bit which provides 
>>>> more
>>>> up
>>>> (elevator down) trim.  (That is if you have a problem with not enough 
>>>> "up"
>>>> trim when in cruise configuration, only one person in front seats.
This
>>>> solution allowed me to not only cruise without pushing forward on the 
>>>> stick,
>>>> but also to trim for a 500 fpm descent with a slight reduction in 
>>>> power).
>>>>
>>>> To move the actuator forward, you will need to cut the canard attach
>>>> bracket
>>>> so that the hole is gone.  Now drill a new hole that is 1/4" to 3/8" 
>>>> forward
>>>> of where the old hole was.
>>>>
>>>> By the way, the bracket shown in the new on-line manual is different
>>>> from my
>>>> 1999 kit.  The new bracket (Long Bracket VAB-02) shown on page 10-8 of 
>>>> the
>>>> online manuals is shorter than mine.  What ever bracket you have, the
>>>> objective is to move the forward part of the actuator about 3/8" toward

>>>> the
>>>> nose of the plane.
>>>>
>>>> Ronnie Brown
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: <aminetech at bluefrog.com>
>>>> To: <reflector at tvbf.org>
>>>> Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 10:03 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Elevator Trim Spring
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>         
>>>>> Ok.  Let's see if I got this.  You're talking about the bracket 
>>>>> that attached the actuator to the canard?  And you shortened the 
>>>>> bracket so you could move it aft? And then
>>>>> you drilled a new hole in to bracket and attached to the old aft hole 
>>>>> in
>>>>> the canard?
>>>>> Did you drill a new forward hole in the canard for the other bolt?
How
>>>>>           
>
>   
>>>>> am
>>>>> I doing?
>>>>>
>>>>> John
>>>>>
>>>>> Ron Brown wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>  John,
>>>>>
>>>>>  I had the same problem with my 173.
>>>>>
>>>>>  I cut the trim actuator front mounting bracket off at the front of 
>>>>> the old  bolt hole.
>>>>>
>>>>>  Then I drilled a new hole about 1/4" or 3/8" ahead of the old 
>>>>> hole. Problem  fixed, and I still have plenty of up trim for take 
>>>>> off.  Easy fix.
>>>>>
>>>>>  Ronnie
>>>>>
>>>>>  ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>  From: "John Dibble" <aminetech at bluefrog.com>
>>>>>  To: "Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list" 
>>>>> <reflector at tvbf.org>
>>>>>  Sent: Sunday, January 29, 2006 3:11 PM
>>>>>  Subject: REFLECTOR: Elevator Trim Spring
>>>>>
>>>>>  > Flying solo, I run out of down trim at 155 IAS.  On the other 
>>>>> hand I  > have plenty of up trim for TOL.  Can I make a wedge shim 
>>>>> where the  > spring attaches to the elevator tube to shift the 
>>>>> adjustment range to  > more down and less up, or do I simply have 
>>>>> to add more glass to the  > spring to make it stiffer?
>>>>>  >
>>>>>  > John
>>>>>  >
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>
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