No subject
Sun Dec 17 12:52:53 CST 2006
static-runup, it sounds to me like the glazed brakes or contamination of the
brake pads.
SB
----- Original Message -----
From: Hiroo Umeno <mailto:humeno at microsoft.com>
To: Velocity Aircraft <mailto:reflector at tvbf.org> Owners and Builders list
Sent: Monday, June 04, 2007 11:57 AM
Subject: REFLECTOR: Brake authority
I had a situation this weekend that heightened the "pucker factor" a bit.
It was a rather warm day (80 or so at sea level) and I landed at a 3400ft
long. Upon touchdown, I braked more firmly than normal since it was a bit
shorter a strip than normal. About mid-way down the strip, I noticed that
the rate of deceleration has decreased a bit. I used the full length of the
3400ft to get it stopped and turned off the active. The parking was at the
other end of the field so I taxied back. It was probably about 5 minutes in
taxi and after getting to the other end of the 3400ft strip, I suddenly
realized that I could only turn left. To make matter worse, once I got the
nose cocked left, I could not straighten it out, either. I had to shut
down, push the plane to the ramp, let the brakes cool off, then taxi.
Now, I've always had an impression that the braking on my plane was "softer"
than other planes I have flown in the past. For example, on the Pipers with
castering nose gears, I could make a "pin-point turn" by locking one wheel
or another by standing on the brake. Not on my plane. I have the let the
plane start rolling and then nudge the nose over gradually. Also at run-up,
I can barely keep it from creeping forward at higher RPMs.
As I have the standard wing and fuselage (SUV), I have the Matco brakes. My
understanding is that the Cleveland upgrade is only necessary on the XL
class aircraft.
How much brake effectiveness should I expect on these Matcos? I am starting
to think I might have an air bubble or two in my lines.
Hiroo
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<div class=3DSection1>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dblack face=3DCalibri><span
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;color:black'>Hiroo-<o:p></o:p></span></font></p=
>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dblack face=3DCalibri><span
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;color:black'>Do you have the 1.25 dia piston =
Matcos’
or the bigger 1.5” dia? The larger ones will give you about =
17%
more clamping force on the rotor. The upgrade is $200 from Matco vs =
$1100 to
change to <st1:City w:st=3D"on"><st1:place =
w:st=3D"on">Clevelands</st1:place></st1:City>.
The Clevelands might still be better by a bit, but the larger =
Matco’s would
be a good try first.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3Dblack face=3DCalibri><span
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p=
>
<div>
<div class=3DMsoNormal align=3Dcenter style=3D'text-align:center'><font =
size=3D3
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'>
<hr size=3D2 width=3D"100%" align=3Dcenter tabindex=3D-1>
</span></font></div>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><b><font size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font =
size=3D2
face=3DTahoma><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'> =
reflector-bounces at tvbf.org
[mailto:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org] <b><span =
style=3D'font-weight:bold'>On Behalf
Of </span></b>Hiroo Umeno<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Monday, June 04, =
2007 12:18
PM<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> <st1:PersonName =
w:st=3D"on">Velocity
Aircraft Owners and Builders list</st1:PersonName><br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: REFLECTOR: =
Brake
authority</span></font><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New =
Roman"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" =
face=3DCalibri><span
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>Scott,<o:p></o:p></span></font><=
/p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" =
face=3DCalibri><span
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></font><=
/p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" =
face=3DCalibri><span
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>Thank you for the =
insight. I am
starting to think that my brakes might be “sub-standard” in =
that
perhaps there is a trapped bubble somewhere. I will bleed it again =
and
see if that makes a difference. I will check for glazing as well =
while
the pants are off.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" =
face=3DCalibri><span
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></font><=
/p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" =
face=3DCalibri><span
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>My transition training was done =
by Steve
Murphree, I believe he is a factory authorized and we did go through the
airspeeds quite a bit.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" =
face=3DCalibri><span
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></font><=
/p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" =
face=3DCalibri><span
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'>Hiroo<o:p></o:p></span></font></=
p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 color=3D"#1f497d" =
face=3DCalibri><span
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt;color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></font><=
/p>
<div>
<div style=3D'border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt =
0in 0in 0in'>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><b><font size=3D2 face=3DTahoma><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font =
size=3D2
face=3DTahoma><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'>
reflector-bounces at tvbf.org [mailto:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org] <b><span
style=3D'font-weight:bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Scott Baker<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Monday, June 04, =
2007 10:10
AM<br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> <st1:PersonName =
w:st=3D"on">Velocity
Aircraft Owners and Builders list</st1:PersonName><br>
<b><span style=3D'font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Re: REFLECTOR: =
Brake
authority<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<div>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>Hiroo -</span></font><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New =
Roman"><span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New =
Roman"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>The Matco W600XT brakes are very effective for SUV, =
SE,
LW/173 model Velocity aircraft.</span></font><font size=3D3 =
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New =
Roman"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>I don't recall if you have been to the factory flight
transition training program - to learn the importance of airspeed =
control on
during landing.</span></font><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New =
Roman"><span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New =
Roman"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>We recommend an approach speed of 1.3 x Vs ...which
translates somewhere around 85-knots for fully loaded aircraft and =
around
80-knots when lightly loaded.</span></font><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times =
New Roman"><span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New =
Roman"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>On a 3000' runway plan on touching down within the =
first
500' to avoid the need for heavy braking.</span></font><font size=3D3
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New =
Roman"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>Fixed gear aircraft with wheel pants should also =
consider
venting the pants to allow ram-air cooling of the brake =
discs.</span></font><font
size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New =
Roman"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>Also check the engine idle speed - and confirm you =
are able
to pull the engine power to full-idle during landing. If the =
engine idle
is high (by 100 rpm or more), this will add a lot to the landing
distance. Failing to completely close the throttle during landing =
also
places extra demands on braking.</span></font><font size=3D3
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New =
Roman"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>Make sure the brake were 'broke-in' correctly and =
that the
discs are not glazed.</span></font><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New =
Roman"><span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New =
Roman"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>From your note describing trouble keeping the =
aircraft
stopped during static-runup, it sounds to me like the glazed brakes or
contamination of the brake pads.</span></font><font size=3D3
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New =
Roman"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:"Times New =
Roman"'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>SB</span></font><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New =
Roman"><span
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New =
Roman"'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<blockquote style=3D'border:none;border-left:solid black =
1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt;
margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt'=
>
<div>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial'>----- Original Message ----- =
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3DMsoNormal style=3D'background:#E4E4E4'><b><font size=3D2 =
face=3DArial><span
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial;font-weight:bold'>From:</span=
></font></b><font
size=3D2 face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> <a
href=3D"mailto:humeno at microsoft.com" =
title=3D"humeno at microsoft.com">Hiroo Umeno</a>
<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><b><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial;font-weight:bold'>To:</span></font></b><font size=3D2
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> <a
href=3D"mailto:reflector at tvbf.org" title=3D"reflector at tvbf.org">Velocity =
Aircraft
Owners and Builders list</a> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><b><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial;font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></font></b><font =
size=3D2
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> Monday, =
June 04,
2007 11:57 AM<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><b><font size=3D2 face=3DArial><span =
style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;
font-family:Arial;font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></font></b><font =
size=3D2
face=3DArial><span style=3D'font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Arial'> =
REFLECTOR: Brake
authority<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:"Times New =
Roman"'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
</div>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>I
had a situation this weekend that heightened the “pucker =
factor” a
bit.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>It
was a rather warm day (80 or so at sea level) and I landed at a 3400ft =
long.
Upon touchdown, I braked more firmly than normal since it was a bit =
shorter a
strip than normal. About mid-way down the strip, I noticed that =
the rate
of deceleration has decreased a bit. I used the full length of the =
3400ft
to get it stopped and turned off the active. The parking was at =
the other
end of the field so I taxied back. It was probably about 5 minutes =
in
taxi and after getting to the other end of the 3400ft strip, I suddenly
realized that I could only turn left. To make matter worse, once I =
got
the nose cocked left, I could not straighten it out, either. I had =
to
shut down, push the plane to the ramp, let the brakes cool off, then =
taxi.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>Now,
I’ve always had an impression that the braking on my plane was =
“softer”
than other planes I have flown in the past. For example, on the =
Pipers
with castering nose gears, I could make a “pin-point turn” =
by
locking one wheel or another by standing on the brake. Not on my =
plane.
I have the let the plane start rolling and then nudge the nose over =
gradually.
Also at run-up, I can barely keep it from creeping forward at higher =
RPMs.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>As
I have the standard wing and fuselage (SUV), I have the Matco =
brakes. My
understanding is that the <st1:City w:st=3D"on"><st1:place =
w:st=3D"on">Cleveland</st1:place></st1:City>
upgrade is only necessary on the XL class =
aircraft.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>How
much brake effectiveness should I expect on these Matcos? I am =
starting
to think I might have an air bubble or two in my =
lines.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D2 face=3DCalibri><span =
style=3D'font-size:11.0pt'>Hiroo<o:p></o:p></span></font></p>
<div class=3DMsoNormal align=3Dcenter style=3D'text-align:center'><font =
size=3D3
face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:12.0pt;font-family:"Times New Roman"'>
<hr size=3D2 width=3D"100%" align=3Dcenter>
</span></font></div>
<p class=3DMsoNormal><font size=3D3 face=3D"Times New Roman"><span =
style=3D'font-size:
12.0pt;font-family:"Times New =
Roman"'>_______________________________________________<br>
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http://www.tvbf.org/mailman/listinfo/reflector<br>
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user:pw =3D tvbf:jamaicangoose<br>
Check new archives: www.tvbf.org/pipermail<br>
Check old archives: =
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nt></p>
</blockquote>
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