REFLECTOR: Re:Fuel Flow Sensor
Chuck Harbert
c.harbert at comcast.net
Thu Jun 30 22:07:17 CDT 2005
Kurt, normal automotive electronic fuel injection systems return the
bypassed fuel back to the cars fuel tank to avoid vapor lock. In this way,
the fuel rail is constantly being supplied with cool tank temp fuel. If you
return the fuel to the inlet of the pump, you are continuing to heat the
fuel inside the engine compartment and from the pumping of the fuel, as it
recirculates in the lines. I recirculate back to the sump tank. Aircraft
engines have the same problem with potential vapor lock which would be a
problem at t/o, especially after a long taxi on a hot day where you're using
little fuel during idle.
I had an auto engine in my plane previously with a similar arrangement as
yours, so in order to accurately measure fuel flow, I had an electric
diverter valve (actually a Ford truck tank switch valve) such that I flipped
a switch to divert the normal flow back to the sump, to a "T" that was
downstream of the floscan (as you have it now). I only used it when I knew
that there would not be the risk of hot fuel in the system. It worked fine.
Chuck H
Subject: REFLECTOR: Fuel Flow Sensor
To: reflector at tvbf.org
Message-ID: <20a.40dfc3e.2ff5a55e at aol.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
I have a question on my fuel flow sensor placement.
My setup is a little different than most Velocities. My 173 FGE has a
2-electric fuel pump manifold with an inlet line, engine line, and regulated
return
line. The regulator keeps the engine pressure side at 25psi, the rest "T's"
back in before the inlet line but after the filter.
My fuel Injection is on TOP of my aluminum V-6. All the plumbing is on the
cabin side of the firewall except from the bulkhead fitting to the fuel
servo.
The instructions on the flow sensor say that it needs to be placed with the
wires in the "up" position, and that a "reasonable" straight section of
tubing
proceed the sensor inlet.
It also recommends that it be placed after the fuel pump(s).
I don't have a reasonable area where I can meet all the requirements and the
recomendation that it be after the pumps.
I can place it in front of the sump, 6" downstream of the sump elbow, with a
straight run after that meets all the requirements. The flow is then up to
the
fuel filter, through the recirculation "T" and to the pump inlet. What it
does not do is place the sensor after the pumps. I do believe it is far
enough
away from all the pumps/recirculation line and filter to avoid any
turbulence
that would confuse it.
Since the recirculation takes place after the sensor, and returns after the
sensor (and well downstream), It measures the amount of fuel that leaves the
sump. This should equal the amount of fuel that the engine is using (barring
a
big leak!).
I can not think of a reason that would require the flow sensor be after the
pumps in my setup, unless there is some flow concern that I am missing.
The exit line from the pumps runs upward from the pumps, through the
pressure
sensor "T" and to the firewall bulkhead connector.
Any input would be appreciated.
Kurt Winker
173 FGE.... bending fuel line.
----- Original Message -----
From: <reflector-request at tvbf.org>
To: <reflector at tvbf.org>
Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2005 5:59 PM
Subject: Reflector Digest, Vol 13, Issue 87
> Send Reflector mailing list submissions to
> reflector at tvbf.org
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> http://www.tvbf.org/mailman/listinfo/reflector
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> reflector-request at tvbf.org
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> reflector-owner at tvbf.org
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of Reflector digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Scott Baker: Is Velocity coming to Arlington Air Show?
> (Chuck Harbert)
> 2. Fuel Flow Sensor (NMFlyer1 at aol.com)
> 3. Is Velocity coming to Arlington Air Show? (Scott Baker)
> 4. Re: Fuel Flow Sensor (HYTEC45 at aol.com)
> 5. Re: Fuel Flow Sensor (Ron Brown)
> 6. Re: Reflector Digest, Vol 13, Issue 86 (Gary T. Ciampa)
> 7. Re: Re: Reflector Digest, Vol 13, Issue 86 (Jack Sheehan)
> 8. Re: Fuel Flow Sensor (Scott Derrick)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 10:15:08 -0700
> From: "Chuck Harbert" <c.harbert at comcast.net>
> Subject: REFLECTOR: Scott Baker: Is Velocity coming to Arlington Air
> Show?
> To: <reflector at tvbf.org>
> Message-ID: <0d7d01c57d97$4ac16850$0201a8c0 at 9B6B411>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
> reply-type=original
>
>
> Scott, I'm in Phase 1 with my plane (18hrs, so far) and Arlington is right
> next door to Paine Field, so I plan to fly in a couple days during the
> week.
> Is Velocity coming to the air show?
>
> Chuck Harbert
>
> p.s. Do you have the phone number of the Velocity builder (Steve Verick or
> Barick?) that has the entry stair fold down cutout on the pilots side of
> his
> plane? I'd like to talk to him on how he did it. Thanks.
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 15:43:26 EDT
> From: NMFlyer1 at aol.com
> Subject: REFLECTOR: Fuel Flow Sensor
> To: reflector at tvbf.org
> Message-ID: <20a.40dfc3e.2ff5a55e at aol.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> I have a question on my fuel flow sensor placement.
>
> My setup is a little different than most Velocities. My 173 FGE has a
> 2-electric fuel pump manifold with an inlet line, engine line, and
> regulated return
> line. The regulator keeps the engine pressure side at 25psi, the rest
> "T's"
> back in before the inlet line but after the filter.
> My fuel Injection is on TOP of my aluminum V-6. All the plumbing is on the
> cabin side of the firewall except from the bulkhead fitting to the fuel
> servo.
>
> The instructions on the flow sensor say that it needs to be placed with
> the
> wires in the "up" position, and that a "reasonable" straight section of
> tubing
> proceed the sensor inlet.
>
> It also recommends that it be placed after the fuel pump(s).
>
> I don't have a reasonable area where I can meet all the requirements and
> the
> recomendation that it be after the pumps.
> I can place it in front of the sump, 6" downstream of the sump elbow, with
> a
> straight run after that meets all the requirements. The flow is then up to
> the
> fuel filter, through the recirculation "T" and to the pump inlet. What it
> does not do is place the sensor after the pumps. I do believe it is far
> enough
> away from all the pumps/recirculation line and filter to avoid any
> turbulence
> that would confuse it.
>
> Since the recirculation takes place after the sensor, and returns after
> the
> sensor (and well downstream), It measures the amount of fuel that leaves
> the
> sump. This should equal the amount of fuel that the engine is using
> (barring a
> big leak!).
>
> I can not think of a reason that would require the flow sensor be after
> the
> pumps in my setup, unless there is some flow concern that I am missing.
>
> The exit line from the pumps runs upward from the pumps, through the
> pressure
> sensor "T" and to the firewall bulkhead connector.
>
> Any input would be appreciated.
> Kurt Winker
> 173 FGE.... bending fuel line.
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL:
> http://www.tvbf.org/mailman/private/reflector/attachments/20050630/8b6e4198/attachment.html
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 16:04:36 -0400
> From: "Scott Baker" <sbakr at comcast.net>
> Subject: REFLECTOR: Is Velocity coming to Arlington Air Show?
> To: "Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list" <reflector at tvbf.org>
> Message-ID: <001001c57dae$f2c73450$0301a8c0 at DAD>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
> reply-type=response
>
> Hello Chuck and All:
> Velocity, Inc. is "passing" on Arlington this year. It's a great show -
> but
> this year we elected to visit the EAA Rocky Mt. Fly-In in Denver.
> Sam Andersen and I just got back from EAA Rocky Mt. Fly-In, which offered
> a
> nice program and pretty large attendance for a regional event. The Rocky
> Mt. Fly-In is now at the Front Range Airport (under Denver Class "B"
> airspace). I would like to publicly thank Tom Martino for allowing us the
> use of his hangar. Denver experienced 50+ mph winds during two of the
> nights we were there - and we were very, very glad to have the aircraft
> inside and well protected.
> By the way, flight time from Sebastian to Denver was 8.1-hours and
> included
> one fuel stop in Tupelo, Mississippi.
> Best regards,
> Scott B.
>
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Chuck Harbert" <c.harbert at comcast.net>
> To: <reflector at tvbf.org>
> Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2005 1:15 PM
> Subject: REFLECTOR: Scott Baker: Is Velocity coming to Arlington Air Show?
>
>
>>
>> Scott, I'm in Phase 1 with my plane (18hrs, so far) and Arlington is
>> right
>> next door to Paine Field, so I plan to fly in a couple days during the
>> week. Is Velocity coming to the air show?
>>
>> Chuck Harbert
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 16:47:47 EDT
> From: HYTEC45 at aol.com
> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Fuel Flow Sensor
> To: reflector at tvbf.org
> Message-ID: <82.2b1c33e1.2ff5b473 at aol.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Know nothing about a "auto" installation, or your type of fuel injection,
> BUT
> can you place it just upstream of the divider leading to the injectors? I
> placed mine between the servo and flow divder. This meeters the actual
> flow
> going to the injectors.
>
> TEC
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL:
> http://www.tvbf.org/mailman/private/reflector/attachments/20050630/b06e1a61/attachment.htm
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 17:41:35 -0400
> From: "Ron Brown" <romott at adelphia.net>
> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Fuel Flow Sensor
> To: "Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list" <reflector at tvbf.org>
> Message-ID: <006301c57dbc$7db25510$a5e4ae45 at romott>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Kurt,
>
> The FloScan sensor instructions naturally recommend a "perfect"
> installation. However, it will work most of the time in just about any
> installation. Just try to follow as much of the recommended installation
> as you can - should work just fine.
>
> Ronnie
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: NMFlyer1 at aol.com
> To: reflector at tvbf.org
> Sent: Thursday, June 30, 2005 3:43 PM
> Subject: REFLECTOR: Fuel Flow Sensor
>
>
> I have a question on my fuel flow sensor placement.
>
> My setup is a little different than most Velocities. My 173 FGE has a
> 2-electric fuel pump manifold with an inlet line, engine line, and
> regulated return line. The regulator keeps the engine pressure side at
> 25psi, the rest "T's" back in before the inlet line but after the filter.
> My fuel Injection is on TOP of my aluminum V-6. All the plumbing is on
> the cabin side of the firewall except from the bulkhead fitting to the
> fuel servo.
>
> The instructions on the flow sensor say that it needs to be placed with
> the wires in the "up" position, and that a "reasonable" straight section
> of tubing proceed the sensor inlet.
>
> It also recommends that it be placed after the fuel pump(s).
>
> I don't have a reasonable area where I can meet all the requirements and
> the recomendation that it be after the pumps.
> I can place it in front of the sump, 6" downstream of the sump elbow,
> with a straight run after that meets all the requirements. The flow is
> then up to the fuel filter, through the recirculation "T" and to the pump
> inlet. What it does not do is place the sensor after the pumps. I do
> believe it is far enough away from all the pumps/recirculation line and
> filter to avoid any turbulence that would confuse it.
>
> Since the recirculation takes place after the sensor, and returns after
> the sensor (and well downstream), It measures the amount of fuel that
> leaves the sump. This should equal the amount of fuel that the engine is
> using (barring a big leak!).
>
> I can not think of a reason that would require the flow sensor be after
> the pumps in my setup, unless there is some flow concern that I am
> missing.
>
> The exit line from the pumps runs upward from the pumps, through the
> pressure sensor "T" and to the firewall bulkhead connector.
>
> Any input would be appreciated.
> Kurt Winker
> 173 FGE.... bending fuel line.
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> To change your email address, visit
> http://www.tvbf.org/mailman/listinfo/reflector
>
> Visit the gallery! www.tvbf.org/gallery
> user:pw = tvbf:jamaicangoose
> Check new archives: www.tvbf.org/pipermail
> Check old archives: http://www.tvbf.org/archives/velocity/maillist.html
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL:
> http://www.tvbf.org/mailman/private/reflector/attachments/20050630/4117159d/attachment.html
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 18:03:10 -0400
> From: "Gary T. Ciampa" <gciampa at nc.rr.com>
> Subject: REFLECTOR: Re: Reflector Digest, Vol 13, Issue 86
> To: reflector at tvbf.org
> Message-ID: <42C46C1E.8040700 at nc.rr.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> Jack,
>
> I'm based out of TTA, it's four to five hours by car to W95, a quick
> hour flight if R5306 is inactive, a few minutes more otherwise.
>
> I got the tee-shirt last week at Howard's and a license plate, what I
> treat! I've been there multiple times, up to HSE and around the
> lighthouse, sweet! I'm still looking for the nudist beach......not that
> I'll go there, just fly over and leer <G>
>
> My engine monitoring systems is a uMonitor, Rocky Mountain Avionics, all
> the normal instrumentation, RPM, TACH, EGT's/CHT's, Oil Pressure and
> Temp, OAT, Volts, Amps, etc...
>
> The RF noise is also coming in the ICS (with the radio's off) so the
> problem must be common to the electrical bus. The battery, starter,
> alternator, voltage regulator connections are all sound, as I just
> finished chasing (and fixing, yea) an intermittent alternator
> low-volltage problem. I shall do some spelunking under the power panel
> and behind the radios....
>
> Cheers,
>
> Gary
>
>>------------------------------
>>
>>Message: 2
>>Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 12:11:31 -0400
>>From: Jack Sheehan <j.f.sheehan at larc.nasa.gov>
>>Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: The Bermuda Triangle in Eastern North Carolina
>> - Or is it Voice of America
>>To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list <reflector at tvbf.org>
>>Message-ID: <p06210204bee9c7ba6573@[128.155.42.101]>
>>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed"
>>
>>Gary,
>>I fly from Hampton Roads into W95 often. I haven't taken to drinking
>>and flying but Ocracoke Island is the only place I have been where
>>they answer the unicom in a bar and will come out and get you. That's
>>at Howard's Pub. I really like the island and the fact that it is
>>hard for folks to get there makes it even better. From here it is
>>about a 6-7 hour drive including a ferry ride. For me it is about a
>>35 minute flight maybe 40 if I have to go around the restricted
>>airspace.
>>I have flown in the area around ISO and near the VOA towers on many
>>trips from here to Florida and have never seen a problem. I have a
>>full glass cockpit but all of my displays are TSO'd which would imply
>>they passed the required HERF and Lightning testing. Most of my
>>wiring is shielded including the VM 1000 ribbon cable which I
>>shielded with AL tape and then grounded the tape.
>>Where are you based?
>>
>>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 20:13:40 -0400
> From: Jack Sheehan <j.f.sheehan at larc.nasa.gov>
> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Re: Reflector Digest, Vol 13, Issue 86
> To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list <reflector at tvbf.org>
> Message-ID: <p0621020abeea3926fb02@[128.155.42.101]>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed"
>
> Great I hope your spelunking works out. I enjoy finding these out of
> the way places.
> Spent last weekend up in Canaan Valley ,WV at the Windwood Fly-in
> resort. http://www.windwoodresort.com/index.htm
> Wow what a well kept secret. Great outdoor vacation hiking
> ,walking.waterfalls horseback riding .Bluegrass music. $50 a night
> hotel at the airport. They will rent you an old car if you want. good
> time
> The runway is a little of a challenge short 2700ft ,elev 3200 hot so
> higher 5000 DA and only 30"wide but fun. I did use all the brakes.
> You need to go in light on fuel and plan on a gas stop close by at
> Elkins or Shenandoah Valley on the way out.
> I think I might go to HSE net weekend just to visit the light house.
> --
> Jack Sheehan
> Executive Director
> National Consortium for Aviation Mobility (NCAM)
> Visit the following sites
> http://www.ncam-sats.org, http://www.sats2005.com, http://sats.nasa.gov
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Thu, 30 Jun 2005 18:59:06 -0600
> From: Scott Derrick <scott at tnstaafl.net>
> Subject: Re: REFLECTOR: Fuel Flow Sensor
> To: Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list <reflector at tvbf.org>
> Message-ID: <42C4955A.6050408 at tnstaafl.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> As TEC says, the fuel flow should be right before the divider.
>
> Scott
>
> HYTEC45 at aol.com wrote:
>
>> Know nothing about a "auto" installation, or your type of fuel
>> injection, BUT can you place it just upstream of the divider leading
>> to the injectors? I placed mine between the servo and flow divder.
>> This meeters the actual flow going to the injectors.
>>
>> TEC
>>
>>------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>To change your email address, visit
>>http://www.tvbf.org/mailman/listinfo/reflector
>>
>>Visit the gallery! www.tvbf.org/gallery
>>user:pw = tvbf:jamaicangoose
>>Check new archives: www.tvbf.org/pipermail
>>Check old archives: http://www.tvbf.org/archives/velocity/maillist.html
>>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> Visit the gallery! tvbf:jamaicangoose
>
> End of Reflector Digest, Vol 13, Issue 87
> *****************************************
More information about the Reflector
mailing list