REFLECTOR: RE: AWLgrip Paint Times

Scott Derrick scott at tnstaafl.net
Sun Jun 19 09:04:54 CDT 2005


Bob,

I need to build a wing jig to paint my wings. What supports the end of 
the  wing when you rotate the jig while your painting?

Scott

Bob Jackson wrote:

> Hello Ronnie,
>  
> Thanks for the idea about a two step process with walk boards over the 
> strakes -- I think that might work.
>  
> Concerning AWLgrip recoat times (I'm not sure why I'm capitalizing it 
> that way, but I like the way it looks!) -- there are actually two 
> separate key times, first what I would call the "coat continuation" 
> time, and second the "recoat without sanding" time.  We have found the 
> "coat continuation" time to be about 1 hour (in Florida during the 
> spring at least).  The "recoat without sanding" time is about 24 hours. 
>  
> "Coat continuation" means that you could paint a portion of the a coat 
> (like say the fuselage top), then remove the walk boards, clean-up, 
> and then continue completing the coat onto the strakes and fuselage 
> bottom, provided you don't wait more than about an hour to continue on 
> with the strakes and bottom.  Otherwise, the paint "seam" between the 
> fuselage top and strakes will not blend together.
>  
> "Recoat without sanding" means that you can paint a second coat 
> anytime up to about 24 hours without having to sand between coats.  
> AWLgrip experts have told us (as rookies) to take advantage of the 24 
> hour recoat time (rather than trying to shoot all two or three coats 
> spaced an hour or so apart) in order to minimize problems with runs.  
> The weight of the second and third coats seems to be cumulative so 
> that you will be more likely to get runs using quicker recoat times.
>  
> We seem to get the best results by spraying a complete coat in one 
> step (i.e., not relying on the coat continuation "grace period"), and 
> even doing these coats in a single pass (i.e., not painting one pass, 
> then a second immediate pass perpendicular to the first).  This is a 
> dangerous approach because you have to get the full amount of paint on 
> in the single pass (and this risks putting on too much and getting 
> runs), but it produces the least amount of orange peel and gives the 
> "deepest" looking and shiniest result.  With AWLgrip you cannot paint 
> light coats (as for example you would generally think of for a first 
> "tack coat") otherwise these sparse spray particles become the "seeds" 
> for more prevalent orange peel on the second pass.  At least in 
> Florida, we've also found that you have to use a higher percentage of 
> reducer (like around 30%) than advertised in order to minimize orange 
> peel. 
>  
> With AWLgrip there is a critical balance between the "drys" (not 
> getting enough paint on), too much orange peel (for the reasons 
> described above), and runs (which can not be be repaired as you would 
> traditionally by sanding out the run, re-top-coating in a local area, 
> then buffing out the boundaries) because AWLgrip is more like a 
> plastic and cannot be buffed.  What this means is that if you get a 
> run, you either have to live with it or resand the surface being 
> painted and repaint.  Of the three types of errors, the pros seem to 
> consider runs as the least objectionable.
>  
> I don't think you will be able to paint the bottom of the fuselage, 
> let it dry, then paint the top (as you've described below) unless you 
> don't mind having an obvious oversprayed, rough boundary between the 
> two areas.  We're doing all our painting with all parts (wings, 
> fuselage, canard, etc.) disassembled.  We created a jig so we can 
> paint the tops and bottoms of the wings in a single pass, which has 
> worked well except for the drys/orange peel/runs problems described 
> above.  Here's a shot of our wing painting rig (you will need to have 
> your Email program setup in HTML mode to view the photo embedded in 
> this message, otherwise it should appear as an attachment):
>  
> AWLgrip painted wing, with a pipe through a hole in the sawhorse to 
> support the wing tip
>  
> Primer-painted wing, showing the wing root end of the paint jig, which 
> is free to rotate in the 2x6 hole
>  
> AWLgrip is used on boats and on airplanes (by Cessna and Airbus, among 
> others).  It is a great paint with outstanding durability and beauty, 
> but because it is painted in a single step (no clear top coating 
> afterwards, and no ability to patch and buff in corrections) it has 
> been very hard, at least for us, to get right.  We painted, sanded 
> down and re-painted one wing five times and are still not really happy 
> with the result, but admittedly we are rooky painters!  I guess that's 
> why they call us experimental/home builders!  We would rather have a 
> paint job that we've done ourselves -- including some imperfections -- 
> than a professional looking job done by someone else.  At least next 
> time we paint the fence it should come out looking better!
>  
> Please let us know how yours goes and what new techniques you may 
> discover,
> Bob Jackson
>
>     -----Original Message-----
>     *From:* reflector-bounces at tvbf.org
>     [mailto:reflector-bounces at tvbf.org]*On Behalf Of *Ron Brown
>     *Sent:* Saturday, June 18, 2005 9:44 PM
>     *To:* bobj at computer.org; Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders list
>     *Subject:* Re: REFLECTOR: Set-Up to Paint (Top of) Fuselage
>
>     Hi Bob,
>      
>     I'm also in the process of painting and I am going to use
>     Awlgrip.  My understanding is that you put on a second coat within
>     an hour or so of the first.  I was planning to use a couple of
>     step ladders and a walk board over the strake, paint the top, then
>     clean up the strake and paint the top of the strake and the rest
>     of the fuselage.  I don't think there will be any problems as long
>     as the adjoining areas are painted in an hour or two of the last
>     coat. 
>      
>     The product sheet says "Recoatability - spray applications consist
>     of two to three coats applied over 1-4 hours." 
>      
>     Have you painted your wings yet? 
>      
>     My plan is to paint the bottom of each wing, one at a time.  Then
>     paint the bottom of the canard and cowls.  Then the fuselage
>     bottom.  I am planning to tilt the fuselage up and let the back of
>     the engine rest on a stool so that I can paint the bottom.  I
>     figure I can tilt the fuselage up about 45 degrees.  Then
>     depending on how lousy of a shooter I am, I'll shoot or hire
>     someone to shoot the tops.  Then the top of the wings and top of
>     the fuselage.
>      
>     Let me know - or I'll let you know in a couple of weeks how it goes.
>      
>     Anybody else that has been there - done that can chime in!!!
>      
>     Ronnie
>      
>       
>
>         ----- Original Message -----
>         *From:* Bob Jackson <mailto:bobj at computer.org>
>         *To:* Velocity Aircraft Owners and Builders List
>         <mailto:reflector at tvbf.org>
>         *Cc:* Bob Jackson (Home) <mailto:bobj at computer.org>
>         *Sent:* Saturday, June 18, 2005 9:10 PM
>         *Subject:* REFLECTOR: Set-Up to Paint (Top of) Fuselage
>
>         Could someone give us some ideas on how you painted your
>         fuselage, please?  We've created a 'jig' to suspend (without
>         gear) our plane in a wings level, or slightly nose-up or
>         down attitude, but now we're wondering what kind of
>         scaffolding arrangement others have created to allow them to
>         reach and cover the very top of the fuselage.  We're using
>         AWLgrip, which is great paint if you can get it on, but it has
>         to be put on in a single pass -- once it's on, you can't go
>         back, sand out runs or blemishes or blend in a patch top coat
>         in small areas.
>          
>         Thanks,
>         Bob Jackson
>
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