REFLECTOR:AERO COMPOSITES PUSHER PROP

Chuck Jensen reflector@tvbf.org
Tue, 27 Apr 2004 16:42:09 -0400


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Lon,
 
You're point is dead on about $150K for an aircraft, then we complain about
a $12K prop.  Some of it is intuition.  Intuitively, it just doesn't seem
right that two or three sticks of wood or plastic should cost almost half of
what an engine costs, even though the engineering is obvious a little tricky
and more difficult to execute properly than one would think---just ask MT.
And of course, the reason it costs $150K to begin with is half the stuff
costs twice what it should.
 
We look forward to more of your comments in the future.  If you contribute
long enough, you too can make a fool of yourself like many of us have
mutiple times.  But so far, your record is sterling.
 
Chuck

-----Original Message-----
From: reflector-admin@tvbf.org [mailto:reflector-admin@tvbf.org]On Behalf Of
Lon Hoskins
Sent: Tuesday, April 27, 2004 1:00 PM
To: reflector@tvbf.org
Subject: RE: REFLECTOR:AERO COMPOSITES PUSHER PROP



I've been reading the Reflector for years. Never commented before. I've
noticed many complaints and much bitching about MT  props., reliability,
service, etc.  Everyone seems to be looking for  an alternative . (a cheap
one, ain't going to happen). Now we have some competition. $14850 vs. $12k+
and expensive shipping from Germany, seems close to me.  We  are building a
$150K+aircraft therefore it doesn't seem excessive to  spend a few thousand
more for better reliability, service and not having to deal with the
germans. Add up having to ship the MT back and forth when it has problems it
comes out fairly close. With a pusher prop I want something that will take
some beating.  Just my opinion.

 


  _____  


From: reflector-admin@tvbf.org [mailto:reflector-admin@tvbf.org] On Behalf
Of HYTEC45@aol.com
Sent: Tuesday, April 27, 2004 7:43 AM
To: reflector@tvbf.org
Subject: Re: REFLECTOR:AERO COMPOSITES PUSHER PROP

 

In a message dated 4/26/2004 9:36:50 PM Pacific Standard Time,
KeithHallsten@quiknet.com writes:

One plus for me is that final assembly is done at American Propeller in
Redding, California (which company is also the MT service center for the
western US), but that might not be as appealing for those on the east side
of the country!

I have been using American Propeller for the repair of my mt.  They helped
with the blade replacement that cracked from harmonic vibration (hence;
restricted RPM).  They also recommended the hub modification to prevent seal
leakage.  After the hub was modified by mt, and reassembled by American, all
three blades leaked big time from the start.  After removing again after 5
hours of operation, Todd, (American Propeller) got approval from mt (after
my bitching) to disassemble and reinstall new seals (others were new).
Again, after return, all three blades began leaking grease big time.  After
contacting American Propeller, and sending more photos, I was told by Todd,
"I don't know what to tell you, maybe you should send it to mt Florida for
repair."  Todd also said that I could fly it until the grease stops coming
out as until then, you know you still have grease.  I'm not talking about
just a little sheen on the prop, but several black streaks on each blade
even after only 1/2 hr. of flight.  American Propeller has told me in the
past that mt is very bad in regard to service and warranty.

 

Here I sit with a propeller that was modified to prevent seal leakage as
recommended by them (never leaked before) yet leaks in all three blades, and
a repair shop that told me to basically "pound sand" because they can't fix
it.

 

My only problem was that I purchased and received a piece of crap, with
failures that are no fault of the owner, yet I am being treated like it is.

 

As always, I agree with Al.  When the grease is gone, I'll put my fixed
pitch back on and be done with the problems.  Then I'll pull it apart myself
and address the problem.

 

TEC (I wonder how much grease it holds).


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<DIV><SPAN class=939341120-27042004><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff 
size=2>Lon,</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=939341120-27042004><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff 
size=2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=939341120-27042004><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>You're 
point is dead on about $150K for an aircraft, then we complain about a $12K 
prop.&nbsp; Some of it is intuition.&nbsp; Intuitively, it just doesn't seem 
right that two or three sticks of wood or plastic should cost almost half of 
what an engine costs, even though the engineering is obvious a little tricky and 
more difficult to execute properly than one would think---just ask MT.&nbsp; And 
of course, the reason it costs $150K to begin with is half the stuff costs twice 
what it should.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=939341120-27042004><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff 
size=2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=939341120-27042004><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>We 
look forward to more of your comments in the future.&nbsp; If you contribute 
long enough, you too can make a fool of yourself like many of us 
have&nbsp;mutiple times.&nbsp; But so far, your record is 
sterling.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=939341120-27042004><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff 
size=2></FONT></SPAN>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=939341120-27042004><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff 
size=2>Chuck</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Tahoma 
  size=2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> reflector-admin@tvbf.org 
  [mailto:reflector-admin@tvbf.org]<B>On Behalf Of </B>Lon 
  Hoskins<BR><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, April 27, 2004 1:00 PM<BR><B>To:</B> 
  reflector@tvbf.org<BR><B>Subject:</B> RE: REFLECTOR:AERO COMPOSITES PUSHER 
  PROP<BR><BR></FONT></DIV>
  <DIV class=Section1>
  <P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-LEFT: 1in; TEXT-INDENT: -0.5in"><FONT 
  face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN 
  style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">I&#8217;ve been reading the 
  Reflector for years. Never commented before. I&#8217;ve noticed many complaints and 
  much bitching about MT &nbsp;props., reliability, service, etc.&nbsp; Everyone 
  seems to be looking for&nbsp; an alternative . (a cheap one, ain&#8217;t going to 
  happen). Now we have some competition. $14850 vs. $12k+ and expensive shipping 
  from Germany, seems close to me.&nbsp; We &nbsp;are building a $150K+aircraft 
  therefore it doesn&#8217;t seem excessive to &nbsp;spend a few thousand more for 
  better reliability, service and not having to deal with the germans. Add up 
  having to ship the MT back and forth when it has problems it comes out fairly 
  close. With a pusher prop I want something that will take some beating.&nbsp; 
  Just my opinion.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN 
  style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
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  face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
  <HR tabIndex=-1 align=center width="100%" SIZE=2>
  </SPAN></FONT></DIV>
  <P class=MsoNormal><B><FONT face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN 
  style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">From:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT 
  face=Tahoma size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma"> 
  reflector-admin@tvbf.org [mailto:reflector-admin@tvbf.org] <B><SPAN 
  style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">On Behalf Of </SPAN></B>HYTEC45@aol.com<BR><B><SPAN 
  style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</SPAN></B> Tuesday, April 27, 2004 7:43 
  AM<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B> 
  reflector@tvbf.org<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> 
  Re: REFLECTOR:AERO COMPOSITES PUSHER PROP</SPAN></FONT><o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
  <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN 
  style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p>&nbsp;</o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
  <DIV>
  <DIV>
  <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN 
  style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">In a message dated 4/26/2004 
  9:36:50 PM Pacific Standard Time, KeithHallsten@quiknet.com 
  writes:<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
  <BLOCKQUOTE 
  style="BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: medium none; MARGIN-TOP: 5pt; PADDING-LEFT: 4pt; MARGIN-BOTTOM: 5pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; MARGIN-LEFT: 3.75pt; BORDER-LEFT: blue 1.5pt solid; PADDING-TOP: 0in; BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none">
    <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN 
    style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">One plus for me is that final 
    assembly is done at American Propeller in <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:City 
    w:st="on">Redding</st1:City>, <st1:State 
    w:st="on">California</st1:State></st1:place>&nbsp;(which company is also the 
    MT service center for the western US), but that might not be as appealing 
    for those on the east side of the 
  country!<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV>
  <DIV>
  <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN 
  style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">I have been using American 
  Propeller for the repair of my mt.&nbsp; They helped with the blade 
  replacement that cracked from harmonic vibration (hence; restricted 
  RPM).&nbsp; They also recommended the hub modification to prevent seal 
  leakage.&nbsp;&nbsp;After the&nbsp;hub was modified by mt, and reassembled by 
  American, all three blades leaked big time from the start.&nbsp; After 
  removing again after 5 hours of operation, Todd, (American Propeller) got 
  approval from mt (after my bitching) to disassemble and reinstall new seals 
  (others were new).&nbsp; Again, after return, all three blades began leaking 
  grease big time.&nbsp; After contacting American Propeller, and sending more 
  photos, I was told by Todd, "I don't know what to tell you, maybe you should 
  send it to mt <st1:State w:st="on"><st1:place 
  w:st="on">Florida</st1:place></st1:State> for repair."&nbsp;&nbsp;Todd also 
  said that I could fly it until the grease stops coming out as until then, you 
  know you still have grease.&nbsp; I'm not talking about just a little sheen on 
  the prop, but several black streaks on each blade even after only 1/2 hr. of 
  flight.&nbsp; American Propeller has told me in the past that mt is very bad 
  in regard to service and warranty.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
  <DIV>
  <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN 
  style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
  <DIV>
  <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN 
  style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Here I sit with a propeller that 
  was modified to prevent seal leakage as recommended by them&nbsp;(never leaked 
  before)&nbsp;yet leaks in all three blades, and a repair shop that told me to 
  basically "pound sand" because they can't fix 
  it.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
  <DIV>
  <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN 
  style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
  <DIV>
  <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN 
  style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">My only problem was that I 
  purchased and received a piece of crap,&nbsp;with failures that are no fault 
  of the owner, yet I am being treated like it 
  is.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
  <DIV>
  <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN 
  style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
  <DIV>
  <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN 
  style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">As always, I&nbsp;agree with 
  Al.&nbsp; When the grease is gone, I'll put my fixed pitch back on and be done 
  with the problems.&nbsp;&nbsp;Then I'll pull it apart myself and address the 
  problem.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
  <DIV>
  <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN 
  style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">&nbsp;<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
  <DIV>
  <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN 
  style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">TEC (I wonder how much grease it 
  holds).<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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